Electrical wiring - is it safe?

Jimmy_Neutron

A couple of halogen bulbs (out of four) have gone out in my bathroom. I thought it would be just a case of replacing the bulbs, but they do not work. I had a look in the loft out of curiosity to see if anything was amiss. I peeled back the loft insulation that was installed last year and was met by the wiring shown in the pictures(links) below. The loft insulations made no mention of unsafe electrical wiring...but that is not their job.

The wiring does not seem safe to me as there are no chocboxes, taping and cable clipped to joists. I was wondering how much it would cost for an electrician, Liverpool area, to make safe this electrical wiring and install a new transformer for the non-working lights?

Thanks for reading and any replies - sorry unable to post pictures or links.

imageshack.us/scaled/landing/594/electricalwiring1.jpg

imageshack.us/scaled/landing/827/electricalwiring2.jpg

imageshack.us/scaled/landing/545/electricalwiring3.jpg

imageshack.us/scaled/landing/829/showerswitch.jpg

imageshack.us/scaled/landing/109/terminalbox.jpg

timbo58

The 'chocolate blocks' shouldn't be used for mains wiring unless completely enclosed in a certified box of some sort (NOT tape!)

The switched spur is a bit heath robinson IMHO: the flex ought to at least be clamped on the insulted outer sheath and have a gland with an appropriately sized hole for the cable outlet.

I wonder what fuse is used? Bet it's a 13A!

HANG ON: is that the power for the SHOWER?
Are you sure?!

Showers require:
a double pole 45amp pull switch on the ceiling fed by an appropriate cable (usually 6mm or 10mm depending on the shower power)
The cable is most certainly NOT a shower power cable and the spur is most certainly NOT able to cope with the power to a shower.

IF this IS connected remove the fuse IMMEDIATELY and call an electrician.

All insulation around the lights ought to be moved a little to allow heat to escape.

Shouldn't be more than a few hours work tops for a sparky but it depends on how many more horrors are revealed?

Jimmy_Neutron

Thanks for the reply.

I'm sorry its not power to the shower its power to the whirlpool bath

southcoastrgi

TimBuckTeeth

That is a mess and unsafe, cobbled together by someone who doesn't know what they are doing. Get an electrician in to fix it. The electronic transformer (the white box) that supplies 12V for the lamps could have blown, they are around £10 to replace.

Mary_Hartnell

There you go with instant advice on what to do but no education on why you need immediate on site professional advice.

So here is my totally unqualified advice:

I have no electrical or medical qualification BUT I have had run ins with qualified practitioners of both trades, where I was right and they were wrong. This does not make me a genius, it just means I am a punter with access to foolgle and time to mull over the information for days rather than minutes, before jumping to a conclusion.

We are all now subject to the new wiring regulations
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/364507

These make the task of working on electrical circuits, particularly in kitchens and bathrooms the monopoly of certified trades persons; so expect a quote to reflect that situation. The installation has to comply with a battery of rules designed to make a drunken smoking idiot "safe" regardless of attempts to change a bulb by standing on the edge of a hot bath, while hanging onto the shower nozzle with the other hand.:eek: (please don't shop me for replacing my own kitchen under cupboard work top lights;))

Do you really want to continue with car headlamp bulbs in your bathroom ceiling? They might be practically outlawed on carbon footprint grounds within the next few years and the cost of replacement bulbs can only spiral upwards, in a vain attempt to reach ever changing standards. Think LED's if you can.
That will take care of any problems of the insulation causing overheating of the lighting circuit.

Do you really want those draughty holes that pierce the fire "proofing" of your plasterboard ceiling?

Your horizontal roof tie, between the two roof rafters, looks like it could be pre war ?
So a photo of the gubbins installed around your meter would give us a guide to the age of your wiring and the standard to which it has been modernised since.

The problem you face is that all electrical work has to be certified and one tradesman cannot certify the work of another (without a battery of tests) and quite frankly your pictures suggest "cowboy" to me.
So it might be as quick and almost as cheap to re-do the circuit back to the "consumer unit" (fuse box).

However the modern requirements are very demanding - any chance of banging a masonry nail into your wall and hitting a cable?

Do you know what sort of supply you have ?

You can start talking the talk here and then manage to employ someone who can walk the walk.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrical_wiring_in_the_United_Kingdom

Mary.

PS you can post pictures in the thread by clicking on the yellow "postcard" icon, showing mountains, above in the row that includes underline bolden and italic options. Just paste the http// ...................... link in the box that appears. Have fun.

baldelectrician

It looks pretty rough, but it's the thing I come across on a daily basis when I visit things others have done

I think the transformers may have overheated and went, these things should have not been covered by insulation. The insulation should not cover spot lights as well

You should use a competent person for the work, links below
In Scotland:
Individuals registered;
http://www.certificationregister.co.uk/ListAC.asp
Companies
http://www.certificationregister.co.uk/SearchCo.asp?T=Construction&ID=2
In England and Wales:
http://www.competentperson.co.uk

keystone

Mary_Hartnell wrote: »

We are all now subject to the new wiring regulations

Which is, however, not retrospective.

....the insulation causing overheating of the lighting circuit.

That is almost certainly why the transformer has blown.

The problem you face is that all electrical work has to be certified and one tradesman cannot certify the work of another (without a battery of tests)

No that is completely wrong. This example of copper knitting could be easily sorted out by a competant DIYer without certification being required.

and quite frankly your pictures suggest "cowboy" to me.

DIY would be better than cowboy because thats almost certainly what it is and not a very good effort either.

PS you can post pictures in the thread by clicking on the yellow "postcard" icon, showing mountains, above in the row that includes underline bolden and italic options.

No he can't. He doesn't have a high enough postcount.

Cheers

Jimmy_Neutron

Thanks for all the replies.

You are not going to believe this but the person/people who I bought the house from worked for the local council as an electrician. You would have thought that an electrician would do the best, and safest, job for his wife and young daughter.

When I moved into the house there was no insulation in the loft. Warmfront installed insulation for me and never mentioned anything about unsafe wiring....not that its their job to do so.
What would be the best way to have downlighters and insulation - use pots/fire guards. Or would changing the bulbs across the upstairs ceilings, 14 bulbs, to LED's be the best way because they produce less heat? If LED's where used would transformers be required?

I want to be armed with questions, and answers if possible, before I call an electrician for a quote to tidy up all the cables across the loft space plus any other electrical work.

Jimmy_Neutron

Just had an electrician visit me. I asked him to give me a quote to replace 14 halogen lights - 5 x 2 bedrooms and 4 in the bathroom with LED, he would also rewire the cables in the loft so everything would be safe. He also said with LED lights there would be no need for transformers as the light fittings would be mains fed.

Breakdown of his quote -

14 x LED light fittings + LED bulbs @£15 per fitting/bulb = £210
Rewire through loft = £120
Certificate and notification = £30
= £360

Is this a reasonable price?