bad advice on transferring from a Gar pension to a SIPP

elsie4700

I was advised by Hargreaves Lansdown to transfer my GAR pension to a SIPP, I discovered this was not the correct thing to do. HL have offered me compensation to be paid into my SIPP but it just doesn't seem to be enough. I have read quite a lot of literature which says I could well have a court case but I really don't know which solicitor I should use. This whole thing has been causing me to feel very stressed out and ill and I just don't know what to do. I am a 58 year old female and my GAR pension was due at 60 - this is all very pertinent to me now as my State pension doesn't kick in until I am nearly 67.

dunstonh

I have read quite a lot of literature which says I could well have a court case but I really don't know which solicitor I should use.

I havent seen any literature to suggest you have a court case. Indeed, these things rarely go near the courts because the FSA regulated complaints process and outcomes that the FSA would expect place less onus on the individual to support their case compared to the courts and the redress methods are usually more favourable.

So, you are saying you have read a lot but there is nothing about any cases that I have read and nothing in the financial press or reports issued suggests the courts being used for GAR complaints. Can you point to any such articles so we can have a read?

This whole thing has been causing me to feel very stressed out and ill and I just don't know what to do.

Realistically, this was a quite straightforward complaint with a high chance of a successful outcome (I have recommended transfer with GAR before quite justifiably - nil bonus rate and only a 3% GAR. However, anything above say 7% and you would expect to win unless it has very strong justification). Plus you had ample time to sort it out as you cannot commence benefits for another 2 years. So, why has it made you stressed and ill?

this is all very pertinent to me now as my State pension doesn't kick in until I am nearly 67.

I can imagine you were frustrated and irritated but I do not buy your view that you suffered stress and illness over this or that it is pertinent to the redress you should get.

What have HL offered you?

I would expect something along the lines of firstly checking the values of the investments of what was recommended and what you had. That could work for or against you as if the recommendation has done better than the existing, the redress would be lower and vice versa. Then they would apply the difference in the Open market rate for 60 against the GAR on a like for like basis and then assume a life expectancy period to calculate a lump sum.

molerat

elsie4700 wrote: »

I am a 58 year old female ......................... my State pension doesn't kick in until I am nearly 67.

How did you work that out, as you were born in 53/54 the latest you will reach SRA is 66.

elsie4700

oh yes you are right, I receive my pension at 65 and 7 months, so I will be nearly 66 not nearly 67, sorry for the error.

elsie4700

dunstonh wrote: »

I havent seen any literature to suggest you have a court case. Indeed, these things rarely go near the courts because the FSA regulated complaints process and outcomes that the FSA would expect place less onus on the individual to support their case compared to the courts and the redress methods are usually more favourable.

so are you suggesting I should go to FSA

So, you are saying you have read a lot but there is nothing about any cases that I have read and nothing in the financial press or reports issued suggests the courts being used for GAR complaints. Can you point to any such articles so we can have a read?

It was reported in the newspapers,


Realistically, this was a quite straightforward complaint with a high chance of a successful outcome (I have recommended transfer with GAR before quite justifiably - nil bonus rate and only a 3% GAR. However, anything above say 7% and you would expect to win unless it has very strong justification). Plus you had ample time to sort it out as you cannot commence benefits for another 2 years. So, why has it made you stressed and ill?

it's lovely that you probably don't get upset and stressed about this sort of thing but that's probably because you understand it.



I can imagine you were frustrated and irritated but I do not buy your view that you suffered stress and illness over this or that it is pertinent to the redress you should get.

yes, frustrated and irritated too.

What have HL offered you?

an amount added to my SIPP but it is 1/5 of the amount that their marketing teams are saying one will need to get the pension that they have worked out the GAR would have paid.


I would expect something along the lines of firstly checking the values of the investments of what was recommended and what you had. That could work for or against you as if the recommendation has done better than the existing, the redress would be lower and vice versa. Then they would apply the difference in the Open market rate for 60 against the GAR on a like for like basis and then assume a life expectancy period to calculate a lump sum.

thanks for your help.

dunstonh

so are you suggesting I should go to FSA

No. The FSA do not handle consumer complaints. They set the procedures that HL have to follow in dealing with the complaint. The process is very defined.

It was reported in the newspapers,

Have you got any links as I have seen nothing in the financial press and nothing on a search. There have been no compliance warnings issued either about court cases being used on these things either. My gut feeling is that you are mixing something up. Either another case (such as Equitable Life) or the actual process used (not courts but the FSA regulated complaints process).

it's lovely that you probably don't get upset and stressed about this sort of thing but that's probably because you understand it.

We all have issues to deal with in life. Some areas we know about, others not but if you are asking for redress because it made you ill then you will have to persuade them that it happened. To me, I dont see this as something that could make you ill unless you already are or there are other causes. If your GP is willing to put in writing that HL is the cause of your illness then you would have better luck on that front.

an amount added to my SIPP but it is 1/5 of the amount that their marketing teams are saying one will need to get the pension that they have worked out the GAR would have paid.

Increasing the SIPP value is the expected method. Have they actually shown their workings for the 1/5th amount? Normally redress payments do show the calculation method and/or reasoning.

Lets assume for the moment they have done the expected method and used current rates and current value vs old value to work out the amount they need to add. What it is that you are after and why?

elsie4700

I will dig out the newspaper I saw it in as I kept the cutting.

We all have issues to deal with in life. Some areas we know about, others not but if you are asking for redress because it made you ill then you will have to persuade them that it happened. To me, I dont see this as something that could make you ill unless you already are or there are other causes. If your GP is willing to put in writing that HL is the cause of your illness then you would have better luck on that front.

I wasn't asking for redress because of my stress, I was just saying how it made me feel.

Lets assume for the moment they have done the expected method and used current rates and current value vs old value to work out the amount they need to add. What it is that you are after and why?

I am just after as much as it will take to get me into the position I should be in, I have suggested to HL that I wait until I am 60 for us to address this correctly with the exact figures from Standard Life and the annuity rates (even though I may lose out) but they didn't respond to that suggestion.

What I am really after is to turn back the clock and keep my original policy but obviously that isn't possible as Standard Life will not do.

dunstonh

I am just after as much as it will take to get me into the position I should be in, I have suggested to HL that I wait until I am 60 for us to address this correctly with the exact figures from Standard Life and the annuity rates (even though I may lose out) but they didn't respond to that suggestion.

The requirement is to put it right now based on current figures available.

If the calculation is fair and laid out so you can see it then that is what you should accept. If you cant understand the calculation then ask HL to explain it to you. If you thnk the calculation isnt fair then give your reasons why you think they have miscalculated it.

jamesd

The purpose of a redress payment is to put you into the position you would have been in if you hadn't been wrongly advised. So in this case it'd be to get you enough extra money into your pension pot to buy an annuity that would pay out as much as the one you can no longer get. If the amount they are offering is less than that then it's possible that there's a problem that needs to be solved. But we don't know enough about the amounts and calculation to say that, though what we do know seems to me to suggest that you may not be getting enough.

You won't know the actual loss or gain until you do buy an annuity.