Positive Spin Help

Moody_Mare

The problem is looking for employment now, he hits a brick wall the second he has to state he was sacked and is awaiting ET. I would love some advice as to how to put a positive spin on this? Knowbody appears to appreciate that he had never even had a warning before this farce begun, he has always had an excellent track record and excellent references prior to this. He was just not prepared to put customers or fellow collegues at severe risk. Any advice as how to word CV/application forms? Any help much appreciated.

blossomhill_2

I hope things turn out well, sorry to hear this

Would he have some time on his hands now to offer some help in the voluntary sector? They would probably welcome his help and it would help build some balance into the CV rather than let it be dominated by the one job that has turned sour on him

Unfortunately, as you may well know, even if he tells prospective employers he is going to ET they may see that as negative (would be take US to ET?), so building up alternative referees may be a good interim solution

All the best

PHYTHIAN

Put on the application form....

Reason for leaving.....Fully prepared to discuss at interview.

Hopefully he can then come across in the right way should he get an interview.

People are nosey and will want to know more!!!!!..worked for me a few years ago when I took a previous employer to an ET (which I won!!).

Good Luck with everything.

denla

Don't go for an out of court settlement. Don't ask for reference instead of money. Ask your colleagues for references in confidence and they'll back you up. When applying for jobs and you've been sacked for gross misconduct, but every one of your colleague aside from management is on your side, employers are more likely to believe you even before seeing the result of ET.

cazziebo

denla wrote: »

Don't go for an out of court settlement. Don't ask for reference instead of money. Ask your colleagues for references in confidence and they'll back you up. When applying for jobs and you've been sacked for gross misconduct, but every one of your colleague aside from management is on your side, employers are more likely to believe you even before seeing the result of ET.

As an employer, I'd view this quite negatively. Not only was this person sacked, but also riled up his former colleagues? Remember, employers are fishing in a big pool at the moment.

The fact he was dismissed is probably less important than the ET to be honest. I think Phythian has given a good solution to get to interview stage. At interview I would say that I escalated concerns about dangerous/illegal practices, following company documented procedures, after which certain of the management made life very difficult for me. I would then quickly define what contribution I had made to the success of the company.

I wouldn't necessarily advise pursuing all the way to the ET - time consuming and energy sapping. If your lawyer deems you have a good case, push it as far as you can and if you get a good settlement with agreed references then take the compromise agreement. Many ETs are won or lost on technicalities so winning won't necessarily convince future employers you were right.

Best of luck

denla

cazziebo wrote: »

As an employer, I'd view this quite negatively. Not only was this person sacked, but also riled up his former colleagues? Remember, employers are fishing in a big pool at the moment.

The fact he was dismissed is probably less important than the ET to be honest. I think Phythian has given a good solution to get to interview stage. At interview I would say that I escalated concerns about dangerous/illegal practices, following company documented procedures, after which certain of the management made life very difficult for me. I would then quickly define what contribution I had made to the success of the company.

I wouldn't necessarily advise pursuing all the way to the ET - time consuming and energy sapping. If your lawyer deems you have a good case, push it as far as you can and if you get a good settlement with agreed references then take the compromise agreement. Many ETs are won or lost on technicalities so winning won't necessarily convince future employers you were right.

Best of luck

Problem is most employers don't give candidates the chance to explain themselves. If you've been sacked for gross misconduct and you're required to mark that on the application form, you'll probably not make it to the interview stage to talk about it.

DVardysShadow

I think that the best you can do is deliver a message which has 3 elements

• Dismissed [it is the truth and no point in hiding it]
• Within 36 hours of raising serious H&S concerns [it may not be anything he has done wrong]
• For which he is going to ET citing whistleblower protection [the truth, no point in hiding it - plus, his head is held high]

No doubt many employers will take a negative view, but I think you have to aim for the least negative view you can get with the truth.

Uncertain

denla wrote: »

Don't go for an out of court settlement. Don't ask for reference instead of money. Ask your colleagues for references in confidence and they'll back you up. When applying for jobs and you've been sacked for gross misconduct, but every one of your colleague aside from management is on your side, employers are more likely to believe you even before seeing the result of ET.

Sorry but this is terrible advice!

Even if he wins "hands down" at a tribunal they have no power to order the firm to provide a positive reference. Apart from some money the only benefit would be being able to say that a tribunal had found in his favour. His reason for leaving is still dismissed for gross misconduct (later found to be unfair by a tribunal).

If he reaches a settlement then there would almost certainly be a confidentiality clause and an agreed reference. His reason for leaving can be whatever he chooses to put as the firm can no longer say otherwise.

The firm may well have a policy preventing employees from giving references other than through their official channels. Any employee providing a "confidential" reference is putting their own employment at risk. If it relates to the firm (as it must if it is anything other than a totally personal character reference) it would be discoverable by the company.

denla

Uncertain wrote: »

Sorry but this is terrible advice!

Even if he wins "hands down" at a tribunal they have no power to order the firm to provide a positive reference. Apart from some money the only benefit would be being able to say that a tribunal had found in his favour. His reason for leaving is still dismissed for gross misconduct (later found to be unfair by a tribunal).

If he reaches a settlement then there would almost certainly be a confidentiality clause and an agreed reference. His reason for leaving can be whatever he chooses to put as the firm can no longer say otherwise.

The firm may well have a policy preventing employee's from giving references other than through their official channels. Any employee providing a "confidential" reference is putting their own employment at risk. If it relates to the firm (as it must if it is anything other than a totally personal character reference) it would be discoverable by the company.

IF OP wins the ET I don't think the new employer will be contacting the old employer... And who's going to tell the old employer their employees gave OP a reference? They'll never know.

Uncertain

denla wrote: »

IF OP wins the ET I don't think the new employer will be contacting the old employer... And who's going to tell the old employer their employees gave OP a reference? They'll never know.

Nonsense in most cases - sorry!

The vast majority of potential employers want both details of, and a reference from, your most recent employer. Unless there are unusual circumstances where this can be erased from your CV without lying then it is difficult to avoid.

The majority of employers will not want to hear that you have taken a previous to an ET regardless of the fact that you may have won. There are two sides to every story and an employer will, quite naturally, tend to be more sympathetic to the employer's side of a dispute. Regardless of the rights and wrongs they are likely to think that the applicant is a litigious troublemaker and may well assume that any win was on a technicality.

If you are close to retirement and are just after the money then going the distance at a tribunal (assuming you have a very strong case) may well be the best thing to do. However, the VAST majority of tribunal awards are small with average being only about £6K despite the very occasional headline grabbing payout.

If you are looking for another job then getting a settlement with a confidentiality agreement and an agreed reference is generally a far better bet.

Regardless of the rights and wrongs it is a rare and principled colleague who will actually stick with you and go against the company line whilst they remain employed.