Cheap ways to live a (veggie) Paleo Life?

grahamc2003

jsnyder wrote: »

True, people did live about 30 years. But from what I read life expectancy didn't really go above 40 until the advancements in medical science. And from what I've read most people died of accidents and being mauled to death by saber tooth tigers rather than things like cancer or diabetes etc. but you may have a point. diets these days are too full of sugars and bad fats. not surprising given the amount spent trying to get us to eat that kind of food!

foraging and hunting sounds nice, my total lack of skills would probably result in my untimely death however !

Coincidentally, radio 4 had a discussion about diets last week. Although every man and his dog would say what you said, surprisingly, the diet during the war was much higher in animal fat, and yet there simply wasn't much obesity, and therefore the problems obesity is associated with, about and I think generally, the view is the elder generation from that period will live longer than youngsters today. That seems to me to be good evidence that animal fats in themselves aren't the demon they are often viewed as today. My view (and I'm no expert in nutrition - and also I think the complexity of the effect of food on our bodies makes even the academic experts floundering as regards unassailable knowledge -) it's much more likely it is the amount of animal fats consumed rather than the fats themselves. That combined with lack of exercise today relative to previous times.

In fact, in terms of our evolution of which animal fats were part, it's possible that vegetable fats (which of course are processed with relatively new technologies not available to prehistoric man and therefore not in our evolution) may eventually turn out to be worse.

jsnyder

grahamc2003 wrote: »

In fact, in terms of our evolution of which animal fats were part, it's possible that vegetable fats (which of course are processed with relatively new technologies not available to prehistoric man and therefore not in our evolution) may eventually turn out to be worse.

Thanks for your response. I agree with this, when I said bad fats I wasn't referring to animal fats. I was thinking more about processed vegetable oils that are used in absolutely everything because it cheaper than the healthier options, such as olive oil. They are hard to avoid if you ever want to eat out, because restaurants use them all the time to save money!

Helen2k8

I would avoid quorn - factory product, not food.

Free range eggs can be found in tesco etc for 99p per half dozen, you may find eggs at the "farm gate" cheaper depending where you live.
Aldi and sainsburys are good for basic but MSC tinned fish/tuna.

Ethnic stores often have fantastic freezers full of whole fish - not that I can read the labels! Are you happy skinning/filleting etc?

May I ask why you don't eat meat? Taste/texture/price etc?

I think normal potatoes are now thought to be suitable by some paleo-enthusiasts; plus swedes, other root crops, cheap and filling. You're not losing anything by dropping grains, but I would consider a multvit just in case. Did you read this? http://www.marksdailyapple.com/dear-carrie-reader-question-roundup/ (Mrs Sisson is pescatarian)

Definitely go for oily fish, you'll need the fats. Fresh mackeral is cheap, as are herring, kippers, etc. Canned salmon usually reasonable too - again check aldi.

Mojisola

grahamc2003 wrote: »

Sounds quaint and romantic, but wasn't human lifespan about 30 years then? I expect improving diets over that time have contributed to the now near 90 year expectation

Don't mix up average life expectancy and the number of years any individual can expect to live.

Average life expectancy takes everyone in the population into account so if a lot of the children die young, the average life expectancy will be reduced but that doesn't mean that the people who survive childhood don't go on to their 60s/70s/80s.

Plenty to read out there -
http://paleodietlifestyle.com/why-cavemen-didnt-die-young/
http://paleodiet.com/life-expectancy.htm

jsnyder - if you're happy to eat fish and eggs, give it a try. Get plenty of oily fish and don't forget all the shellfish and seaweeds as well. Elaine Morgan has written about the theory that our brains were able to grow larger because we made use of the bounty of the sea -
https://www.www.elainemorgan.me.uk/page15.html

Helen2k8

Seaweed! That reminds me, all kinds of dried seaweed and "fungus" in Chinese supermarkets.
Nori sheets are normally used to wrap sushi but you could wrap all sorts with them, kombu I normally throw in when I'm brewing a stock or soup, but then take it out/don't eat it. Wakame is nice in soups etc too, my god it expands from dried!!

jsnyder

Hi Helen2k8, those things sounds delicious (and also expensive!). Yeah I've head some people eat potatoes, I guess it depends how serious you are about following the diet.

I don't eat meat for ethical reasons, rather than taste or price. I think that if we living outdoors and hunting animals was the only way to survive then that would be fine, but right now I don't think it's necessary to kill animals to survive. Also, the amount of land and other resources it takes to produce meat could feed far more people if used for vegetables and..dare I say it...grains!

Mojisola, completely agree about life expectancy and life span. Also here is some great data showing that life expectancy didn't really increase until the early 1900's - http://www.gapminder.org - check graph that shows life expectancy by years, it shows that in 1900 life expectancy in the US was 46 and in the UK 45. Not a great deal higher than the life expectancy prior to agriculture (roughly 10,000 years earlier).

Yeah I'm willing too eat some fish, thanks for the links, they are really interesting.

Mojisola

jsnyder wrote: »

Mojisola, completely agree about life expectancy and life span. Also here is some great data showing that life expectancy didn't really increase until the early 1900's - http://www.gapminder.org - check graph that shows life expectancy by years, it shows that in 1900 life expectancy in the US was 46 and in the UK 45. Not a great deal higher than the life expectancy prior to agriculture (roughly 10,000 years earlier).

I read an interesting report recently that said that researchers were starting to re-evaluate the presumed age of skeletons from early human history (pre-agriculture). It's thought that the ages of the bones may have been underestimated because researchers had looked at them in the light of what happens to modern bones.

The thinking is that because the deterioration that is expected in modern bones wasn't present, the remains were all thought to be of younger people. If the damage that is considered normal now is a result of post-agricultural diets, the earlier remains could have been from older people.

It's already well known that our ancestors' health took a nose-dive when they changed from being hunter/gathers to farmers.

Helen2k8

jsnyder wrote: »

I don't eat meat for ethical reasons, rather than taste or price. I think that if we living outdoors and hunting animals was the only way to survive then that would be fine, but right now I don't think it's necessary to kill animals to survive. Also, the amount of land and other resources it takes to produce meat could feed far more people if used for vegetables and..dare I say it...grains!


Yeah I'm willing too eat some fish, thanks for the links, they are really interesting.

Not being picky, but sheep are grown on land that will produce little else, and also provide wool and maintain that upland habitat, whilst we don't know what damage we have done to the sea by (over)fishing. Just something to ponder

But yes, factory farmed meat is something to avoid.

Edwardia

I went low carb two years ago then organic in March and discovered that my diet is pretty much primal and I read Mark Sisson's website www.marksdailyapple.com as well as those of Dr Loren Cordain MD www.thepaleodiet.com Dr Andreas Eenfeldt MD www.dietdoctor.com and Dr John Briffa www.drbriffa.com

At my heaviest I was UK size 22 and am now nearly size 12. I have diabetes and my blood glucose was 13% above normal when diagnosed in 2007 but hovers around normal all the time now.

My advice would be to eat leafy veg in preference to root veg when poss (you can check carbs on www.glycemicindex.com) and to eat wild fish or organic farmed. Quorn is soil mould fed on glucose in silos then processed and is not a natural product at all.

The key is variety though, to make sure you have a balanced diet nutritionally.

thankfulW

Thank u e'one 4 paleo info. :j