6 storey flat with no lift

GMS

I will be slaughtered for saying this but it went wrong because you dealt with unqualified sales staff. Any mortgage adviser who dealt with this case would have had the property pre agreed or not with the proposed lender.

HSBC staff want to get their points for their bonus like any other bank staff and have little or no regard for the clients which when coupled with little knowledge of their own criteria is a dangerous mix.

A proper broker would have had the alarm bells ringing early on. Ex local authority/housing association flat. How many in private ownership? Any balcony access? Any lift? Etc etc.

opinions4u

jamesadean wrote: »

Ok, we definitely got an official mortgage offer before the survey. I have the letter dated 2 weeks before the survey happened

Are you sure this isn't an agreement in principle?

We consulted a mortgage advisor, worked out how much we could lend,

Pet hate. The word is borrow. You borrow. They lend.

found a property, applied for the mortgage, got an offer, chose countrywide panel who appointed solicitors and surveyor!

I don't understand how we could have gone so wrong!

Asking them for an explanation of their process and justification of costs incurred is a good starting point.

For me, any costs other than valuation should be refunded.

jamesadean

Absolutely, decision in principle was sent very early on. Full offer was subsequently sent. We were asked several things about the property, such as is it brick and ex-local, over the phone on the application. But we certainly were not asked if it had a lift!

Could it be that the official offer letter is how much they are prepared to lend us? Not actually based on the property? But then I can't understand why they would have engaged the solicitors through country wide, without a survey?

Dave_Ham

HSBC do not use brokers per say, so we all have little experience with their procedures. My understanding is that they offer you the funds, then assess they are happy with the property at which point you receive the full mortgage offer.

Clearly they were happy with you as an applicant/s, but not the property.

I think you should complain and whilst I think the valuation fee will stand, hard pushed to justify the search fees. You can obviously still use the solicitor with a new lender, although that may not be the most sensible move (just my opinion)

In the midst of this you need to secure finance and quickly as the Estate Agent will probably be all over you by now.

Good news is that if HSBC accepted you, you are likely to have the pick of the banks subject to a suitable valuation.

See a broker and quickly as once you share the full address, we can call in advance to check suitability.

Chances are the more flexible lenders will be open minded on the number of floors/lift situation, but will still mark as subject to valuers comments. This means another valuation fee may be at risk. Depending upon your status as a buyer, you may be a able to get a free valuation as part of the package - whether that reflects best advice, would be depending upon your overall situation.

Good luck

holly_hobby

As already stated, you have recd a DIP which is not a full mortgage offer, but a tacit agreement as to YOUR suitability re your circs and the loan requested - the issue of a formal offer being obtained post survey.

That being said, continuing with the property and merly going to a different lender, may result in the instruction of the same panel surveyor(s) - and you're back to square one re his comments.

So, as DH states, you/your broker need to initially qualify the suitability of the property with the alternative lender selected - where you/he specifically ask if a flat with 6 storeys and no service lift, will pose an UW issue.

If you get the green light, you note the UWs name who has given the AIP re property suitability, and ensure that when the full app is submitted that an accompanying note is inc re the property issue discussed & UW sign off.

You may find that it is difficult to secure a mge for this unit, which begs the question that if you do finally locate a taker, that any future potential buyers of your own (if you elect to sell the flat) may face the same or even more restrictive lending in the future, leaving you quite royally stuck with cash buyers - something to consider before you jump into this.

Hope this helps

Holly

jamesadean

Just found out that a mortgage buyer has just purchased a flat in the same block!

I called HSBC to discuss the decision and ask why they didn't inform us earlier, but they absolutely could hardly be bothered to even have the conversation with me - they did admit however they could have informed me about the criteria of a lift much earlier - but apart from that, were completely un-interested. We are stuck with solicitors and search fees as an outcome!

Our mortgage broker is busy looking for alternative lenders. Wasted 3 months!!

holly_hobby

Well I would suggest finding out whom the other purchasers mortgagee is ..... but you may find that they may reject your app on exposure. May be worth a punt though if you can establish who they are ?

From HSBC side of things, did the app ask any details about the flat i.e no of storeys, if there was a lift etc - or did the issue re storeys/lift only come to light when the surveyor went out ?

If it only came to light when the surveyor went out - then its just a pill to swallow I would suspect, and would suggest that such request for info needs to be inc in their mge app to highlight any issues pre incurrance of survey/admin fees etc.

If their app did request such data, or you can prove they knew pre survey of the absent lift - and lets not forget this issue is apparently their standard criteria - then there is an arguement for their negligence, in informing you pre-survey of non-suitability re the property, thereby avoiding the unnecessary incurrance of fees and time.

TBH as a side issue - searches should never have commenced prior to survey and formal mge offer - but thats academic at the moment.

H x

ACG

Write an official letter of complaint. I think you will get the valuation fee and sols fees back.

They should have systems in place to check this and if they dont in my opinion thats their systems lacking which isnt your fault.

jamesadean

I was asked a huge number of questions about the flat such as how many floors, above commercial property, concrete or brick build, age, lease... lots and lots - never anything about if there was a lift!

I will certainly write a letter of complaint I think! It just seems so odd because these flats are really desirable and in a very good investment area of London...

Thanks for the amazing advice on here - it really has helped a lot!

holly_hobby

jamesadean wrote: »

I was asked a huge number of questions about the flat such as how many floors, above commercial property, concrete or brick build, age, lease... lots and lots - never anything about if there was a lift!!

That gives more weight to an argument that as part of the application process, and the requirement of a lift (as standard criteria) over a certain no of storeys, to be fundamental to the suitability of the property - that this question should have been posed alongside the other determination questions you have listed inc pointingly the one regarding how many floors formed the block (thats your pivotal point to base the absence of the lift question argument).

jamesadean wrote: »

I will certainly write a letter of complaint I think! It just seems so odd because these flats are really desirable and in a very good investment area of London...

It will do no harm at all - and if you err on the fact that despite a copious amount of questions relating to the flat, a main criteria factor regarding the suitability of the unit based on a service life was omitted to be determined/asked, demonstrates a rather lax application process, which has resulted in the incurrance of fees that would have otherwise been avoided, IF they had asked along with the no of storeys if there was an active lift (seeing as it is so obviously fundamental to the suitability of the property for mge purposes).

Keep your letter punchy, factual and polite, also stating what action you require in resolution of the matter. (nb - you may be lucky to also have the legals reimbursed, due to what could be considered (and I would argue as the investigating officer) as premature instruction of searches etc (ie pre offer) - but give it a punt you've absolutley nothing to lose and everything to gain).

I understand completely your comments re the flat and desirability, but you have to look at it from the lenders point of view. In the event of their possession, they want to market this to the widest possible market, for the quickest possible sale at the best price possible. Now a flat is generally speaking already a restricted market (notwithstanding London is typically a niche area of demand for flats), couple that with no lift and more than 2 storeys - you narrow your captive audience even further - hence their stance (which intrestingly it is apparent that not all lenders have adopted, if as you say, you have a fellow purchaser whom has secured new mge lending within the unit).

How far along is your broker with sourcing an alternative provider ? Keep on his/her tail to ensure they are actively trying to place this via their various BDM lender contacts, then make a decision as to whether its worth pursing given that any purchaser of yours may face exactly the same issues if a mge is reqd to fund the purchase.

Hope this helps ...

H x