Should automatic benefits be cut for those who "don't need them"?

Graham_Devon

BobQ wrote: »

What a mean spirited lot some of you are!

Why?

Whats mean spiritied in discussing whether someone who doesn't need the money should still get money from the state?

thistledome

Loanranger wrote: »

Who said, youth is wasted on the young? Can't remember, that'll probably be the dementia rearing its ugly head.

It was George Bernard Shaw and he was dead right IMO.;)

BobQ

Loanranger wrote: »

Who said, youth is wasted on the young? Can't remember, that'll probably be the dementia rearing its ugly head.

It was George Bernard Shaw.

Pensioner bashing is a consequence of the selfish me first anti-social behaviour that has been inculcated into so many young people. They will suffer the consequences when they get older, having failed to plan for their old age, and realise their children are even less tolerent of their parent's generation than they were.

JanCee

PaulF81 wrote: »

You will be dead quicker if we cut fuel payments and pointless operations for those over 75.

I agree with this provided it only comes into force in the year that you turn 75.

BobQ

Graham_Devon wrote: »

Why?

Whats mean spiritied in discussing whether someone who doesn't need the money should still get money from the state?

Not saying its mean spirited to discuss it, just that "some" people have a very negative attitude to the older generation and this comes across in their postings.

I agree how to spend taxes etc is a legitimate debate to have but means testing or withdrawing benefits from the old and vulnerable because some of them are wealthy is not in my opinion morally acceptable. The best way to redistribute income is taxation.

Graham_Devon

BobQ wrote: »

Not saying its mean spirited to discuss it, just that "some" people have a very negative attitude to the older generation and this comes across in their postings.

I agree how to spend taxes etc is a legitimate debate to have but means testing or withdrawing benefits from the old and vulnerable because some of them are wealthy is not in my opinion morally acceptable. The best way to redistribute income is taxation.

But who is suggesting they are taken from the old and vulnerable?

This sort of outrage ruins the discussion IMHO. No one is discussing or suggesting doing such.

CKhalvashi

The_J wrote: »

As for free bus passes this is absolutely vital. Have you seen old people driving?

I know of some people that are still good drivers, and a lot of young drivers that smash a car up about every 12 months and try to run over their boss occasionally (not taking a stab at one of my employees).

Maybe we should give the person in question a free bus pass for the general safety of everyone?

CK

grizzly1911

PaulF81 wrote: »

You will be dead quicker if we cut fuel payments and pointless operations for those over 75.

Advocating state sponsored euthanasia:think:

Should get pension costs down generally and improve annuity rates for those that can afford a pension of their own too.

With the increasing retirement age getting close to this threshold we can no doubt cut taxes and NI too:rotfl::rotfl:

Jennifer_Jane

The_J wrote: »

Not only should old people get a fuel allowance but people under the age of 40 should have to pay double prices for fuel. That might teach them to put a jumper on instead of turning the heating on. I was aghast to find young people spending £100 a month on gas, this is absolutely preposterous. We live in England, not the Arctic. Man up you !!!!!!s.

As for free bus passes this is absolutely vital. Have you seen old people driving?[/QUOTE]

LOL! That's a very good point (although disagree with it with regard to MY driving, of course).

But regarding the bus pass - could someone please explain in words of two syllabubs (yes, I know it's syllable), what the problem is? If people have cars they tend to use them rather than walking to the bus stop, and then queuing in the rain for a bus. If people don't have cars or are too old and doddery to drive, then they use the bus pass. Surely, by it's nature, it's only used by people who need it?

Re the Winter Fuel Allowance, I'm really grateful for this. Re the £10 Christmas bonus, I think this should go and the basic state pension increased to compensate. Wouldn't that decrease the admin, at least?

BobQ

Graham_Devon wrote: »

But who is suggesting they are taken from the old and vulnerable?

This sort of outrage ruins the discussion IMHO. No one is discussing or suggesting doing such.

Well you are. You open a discussion with weasel words suggesting that we should consider removing automatic benefits from those who do not need them (without specifying who these are) but also suggest that they should remain for those in need of them (again without saying who these are).

Now I can agree that Paul McCartney does not need a winter fuel allowance or a bus pass (if indeed he takes them) and I can agree that a 90 year old pensioner on a basic state pension does need some help. But you have not said anything about who you would cut benefits from.

Unless you are prepared to be more specific you should expect such comments, however outrageous you think it is.

My view is that leave them as universal benefits, assign a cash value to them, and make them taxable, this would be a pragmatic and fair way of clawing back some of the costs from those who do not need them. Its not perfect but what would you do? Means tests? Vouchers? How much more would this cost to administer?