Should automatic benefits be cut for those who "don't need them"?

ukcarper

N1AK wrote: »

I'd make as many benefits universal as possible, or get rid of them. The money would be raised by additional taxation. The state pension should be enough to heat your house, if it isn't it would need to be higher.

I would set the state pension at a level that would support a couple living in a two bedroom apartment. If they want to live in a larger property that's fine but it would be at their own cost.

If I had to guess I'd say that the state pension would end up 5-8% lower in real terms (ignoring incorporating heating allowance).

I'd increase the state pension age more quickly than is currently planned. I would also make the IHT (inheritance tax) threshold lower and would change the law so that savings/property owned by people who didn't pay sufficient NI/tax during their working life could be reclaimed on their death to cover some of the cost.

I agree that trying to reclaim universal allowance via income tax would be a good idea.

I’m not sure £100 a week is enough to live on which is what the state pension would be if you reduced it by 8%.

On the subject of what tax payers done for the country between 1950 and 1990 they did reduce the national dept from almost 250% of GDP to less than 50%.

As for your last point I would have though that most people who have savings and property would have paid a fare amount of tax and ni and if they though what they did have was going to the government they would make sure they spent it.

BobQ

Graham_Devon wrote: »

It's fact that the current generation of retirees and approaching retirees have / will take more out of the system than they put in. By quite some way too..

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What is the evidence for this?

Graham_Devon wrote: »

Theres been some serious offence taken on this thread by some of the older generation. I'm really not sure why.

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I suspect the reason is that they see it as the thin end of the wedge. On the face of most people do not have a problem with removing univeral benefits from millionaires, many would not object to higher rate tax payers losing them, but the question is where do you stop? I am sure many younger people do not fully appreciate the problems of getting old and while there are many fit and healthy pensioners there are also many that are very vulnerable and do not expect to have to resort to means tests to enjoy what they see as basic rights.

seven-day-weekend

The reason some people have taken offence is that many of us have worked hard all our lives without the raft of Benefits available today, without equal pay or opportunities, without equal access to things like pensions and mortgages, with no maternity/paternity/sick cat leave to speak of, paid for our children ourselves (other than around £7 a week Child Benefit) and then we are begrudgesd a Bus Pass.

Graham_Devon

seven-day-weekend wrote: »

The reason some people have taken offence is that many of us have worked hard all our lives without the raft of Benefits available today, without equal pay or opportunities, without equal access to things like pensions and mortgages, with no maternity/paternity/sick cat leave to speak of, paid for our children ourselves (other than around £7 a week Child Benefit) and then we are begrudgesd a Bus Pass.

I really fail to see what you are offended about though?

All of those things you list were much better than what your parents and their parents had to live through. It's progress.

My generation may not even have a state pension to look forward to. Yet people get offended over the lack of a bus pass for those who can perfectly afford to get the bus?

As I stated earlier, it seems most of the offense comes from a basic entitlement mentality.

Certainly I feel my generation are accepting the fact things need to change easier than the older generation, based on threads on this site.

We have 25% youth unemployment, an ever increasing debt, but sod that, we need to make sure millionaires can catch a bus for free because they were simply born earlier. We direct winter fuel payments to the wealthy, while denying life extending drugs to those with cancer. We give bus passes out to people who can perfectly afford to catch a bus, and shut down restpite services for those really in need.

I really cannot see where the offence is coming from. All I can see is a massive sense of entitlement. THAT may offend, but I'm only stating the truth in what I see.

Graham_Devon

BobQ wrote: »

What is the evidence for this?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2011/mar/15/babyboomers-welfare-politics-tax

ukcarper

Graham_Devon wrote: »

I really fail to see what you are offended about though?

All of those things you list were much better than what your parents and their parents had to live through. It's progress.

My generation may not even have a state pension to look forward to. Yet people get offended over the lack of a bus pass for those who can perfectly afford to get the bus?

As I stated earlier, it seems most of the offense comes from a basic entitlement mentality.

Certainly I feel my generation are accepting the fact things need to change easier than the older generation, based on threads on this site.

We have 25% youth unemployment, an ever increasing debt, but sod that, we need to make sure millionaires can catch a bus for free because they were simply born earlier. We direct winter fuel payments to the wealthy, while denying life extending drugs to those with cancer. We give bus passes out to people who can perfectly afford to catch a bus, and shut down restpite services for those really in need.

I really cannot see where the offence is coming from. All I can see is a massive sense of entitlement. THAT may offend, but I'm only stating the truth in what I see.

I wouldn’t have though anybody would mind if millionaires lost their bus pass but then I would imagine not many have applied for them.

The difficulty is where you draw the line in a way that is fare and cost effective.

CLAPTON

Graham_Devon wrote: »

I really fail to see what you are offended about though?

All of those things you list were much better than what your parents and their parents had to live through. It's progress.

My generation may not even have a state pension to look forward to. Yet people get offended over the lack of a bus pass for those who can perfectly afford to get the bus?

As I stated earlier, it seems most of the offense comes from a basic entitlement mentality.

Certainly I feel my generation are accepting the fact things need to change easier than the older generation, based on threads on this site.

We have 25% youth unemployment, an ever increasing debt, but sod that, we need to make sure millionaires can catch a bus for free because they were simply born earlier. We direct winter fuel payments to the wealthy, while denying life extending drugs to those with cancer. We give bus passes out to people who can perfectly afford to catch a bus, and shut down restpite services for those really in need.

I really cannot see where the offence is coming from. All I can see is a massive sense of entitlement. THAT may offend, but I'm only stating the truth in what I see.

why will your generation not have a state pension to look forward to?

is that because you will vote for politicians who will abolish it?

Graham_Devon

CLAPTON wrote: »

why will your generation not have a state pension to look forward to?

is that because you will vote for politicians who will abolish it?

Obviously I meant in terms of whats enjoyed now.

CLAPTON

Graham_Devon wrote: »

Obviously I meant in terms of whats enjoyed now.

why is that ?

Graham_Devon

ukcarper wrote: »

I wouldn’t have though anybody would mind if millionaires lost their bus pass but then I would imagine not many have applied for them.

So what's all the offence about?

No one has given a cut off. There isn't one applied. Its just people suggesting "we", i.e. the younger generation are venomous simply for suggesting it needs to be looked at.

Of course the people who really want to look at it for real, are the lords, NOT us, the younger generation. Just seems WE get the flack for it, and myself particularly for putting the thread up, simply because it will effect the retired, therefore, I'm against them.