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Austerity Vs Growth
Comments
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HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »It's nothing like a household.
A person has an income limited to a lifetime..
A country has the ever growing revenue from it's taxpayers until infinity, with inflation eroding the value of debts over decades or even centuries.
It is like a household, you have to prioritize what you spend the money you have coming in on. At the moment we are spending far to much on frimm fram fancies and PR whims. We need to get a grip and use that money much more constructively.
I do get your point about revenue coming in from taxpayers over a longer scale than a household. This is not the first time the country has had a large deficit, mostly it's been after we've been in wars, this time our own greed has caused it. Like previous times we will get it down if we can bring some financial sense back in to play. We can not just keep putting things on the never never for infinity. In simple terms it's just not fair to pile more and more debt on to future generations just so we get to play 'I'm all right Jack' in the here and now.[FONT="]“I've learned that people will forget what you said, people will forget what you did, but people will never forget how you made them feel.” ~ Maya Angelou[/FONT][FONT="][/FONT]0 -
An organisation in todays press suggests there'll be around 700,00 less in the public sector by 2016...so right or wrong theres a start ..
Not sure which 10 year period the article is using but the links below show 2001 and 2011...
Healthcare..Education and Welfare have all gone up more than the other sectors...
Maybe some things are going up more than the governments measure of inflation....as we all know with our daily buying..
http://www.ukpublicspending.co.uk/year_spending_2001UKbn_11bc1n#ukgs302
http://www.ukpublicspending.co.uk/year_spending_2011UKbn_11bc1n#ukgs3020 -
The_White_Horse wrote: »they need to sack at least 20% of public sector and then reduce the remaining workers salaries by 30%. I was speaking to someone yesterday who told me his wife is a physio in the nhs - on 50k!! absolute insanity. and think of the final salary pension liability. it is a disgrace. the public sector needs massive cuts. if they want to strike, fine. i am willing to fight them.
Actually they've already thought of that one. A lot of public sector organisations have seen a 30% reduction in workforce due to various early retirement/redundancy schemes. Also, the combined effect of pay freezes and increased pension contributions will see real terms reductions in salaries of about 25% for many.
Just to reassure you though - I'm still working in the public sector and I earn more than £50k:p0 -
Originally Posted by HAMISH_MCTAVISH
It's nothing like a household.
A person has an income limited to a lifetime..
A country has the ever growing revenue from it's taxpayers until infinity, with inflation eroding the value of debts over decades or even centuries.
This is exactly the sort of fiscally incontinent thinking that got Europe into the mess it is in. Are you so stupid that you can't see this and learn from the mistakes of others?0 -
Yes just like that
“five years on, the M6 Toll continues to provide an alternative route to the M6 for motorists .”
One thing that can't be disputed.:T"If you act like an illiterate man, your learning will never stop... Being uneducated, you have no fear of the future.".....
"big business is parasitic, like a mosquito, whereas I prefer the lighter touch, like that of a butterfly. "A butterfly can suck honey from the flower without damaging it," "Arunachalam Muruganantham0 -
Probably got something to do with an ever growing population.
Wonder how it fits in proportion to the population and whether we also factor in increased proportional taxation."If you act like an illiterate man, your learning will never stop... Being uneducated, you have no fear of the future.".....
"big business is parasitic, like a mosquito, whereas I prefer the lighter touch, like that of a butterfly. "A butterfly can suck honey from the flower without damaging it," "Arunachalam Muruganantham0 -
I think the argument of austerity against growth is being over done. There is a middle ground and we can do both. I also think this county needs to do some spending in order to give growth a kick start. Spending should not automatically equal borrowing though.
I do think it's very much like a household. If the household gets into financial trouble, you make cuts where you can (but you can't cut everything). One think you do cut up is the cards and you stop borrowing. Then you prioritize the money you've got and decided where you spend it to get the most from your money, ie Marks & Spencer's is out and Aldi is in.
the difference is this
when a family cuts back there is an improvement in their financial position.
when a whole country cuts back; each cut is also some-one elses lost job; a lost job is a family in much worse financial difficulty who will have to cut back and hence more unemployment is created.
and the government finances don't necessarially improved as less people are paying taxes and more people claiming benefits.
which is why the problem is a little difficult to solve.0 -
the difference is this
when a family cuts back there is an improvement in their financial position.
when a whole country cuts back; each cut is also some-one elses lost job; a lost job is a family in much worse financial difficulty who will have to cut back and hence more unemployment is created.
and the government finances don't necessarially improved as less people are paying taxes and more people claiming benefits.
which is why the problem is a little difficult to solve.
What you have not considered at all is the risk of a gilt strike, leading to massive rises in interest rates which will trigger widespread corporate & house hold default.
Given the size of the UK's banking sector and the indebtedness of the country as a whole, the impact of that would be catastrophic.
Also, it is worth noting that bond markets have turned incredibly quickly on countries - in as little as 8-12 weeks in the case of Portugal & Ireland. Contrast the length of that period against the 5+ years it is taking for the UK to eliminate its budget deficit.
If you don't see a huge risk there then I'd suggest you blind fold yourself and try crossing a road at random.0 -
the difference is this
when a family cuts back there is an improvement in their financial position.
when a whole country cuts back; each cut is also some-one elses lost job; a lost job is a family in much worse financial difficulty who will have to cut back and hence more unemployment is created.
and the government finances don't necessarially improved as less people are paying taxes and more people claiming benefits.
which is why the problem is a little difficult to solve.
Also, it is easier to escape recession if you are the only country suffering from one.'Just think for a moment what a prospect that is. A single market without barriers visible or invisible giving you direct and unhindered access to the purchasing power of over 300 million of the worlds wealthiest and most prosperous people' Margaret Thatcher0 -
I admire those car workers in the north
eccky thump - it's only Cheshire
And we need to get a grip on immigration – let people in who are going to be useful to the economy, but not those (the majority) who simply want to sponge off taxpayers and will drag the economy down still further. This includes citizens of EU countries. If EU laws state that we have to let in every Tom, !!!!!! and Harry, then the laws need to change.
Whilst not PC, I am sure that Immigration, although it can bring advantages if used appropriately, is a adding to our problems.
Not just in any direct benefit costs but more in the un-costed impact on infrastructure, schooling, health etc. where demand comes before effective contribution.
Wyy do places like Australia not have free borders?"If you act like an illiterate man, your learning will never stop... Being uneducated, you have no fear of the future.".....
"big business is parasitic, like a mosquito, whereas I prefer the lighter touch, like that of a butterfly. "A butterfly can suck honey from the flower without damaging it," "Arunachalam Muruganantham0
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