MSE News: Unemployment to 'keep on rising'

Randvegeta

You are assuming everyone unemployed is a "layabout."

If the system can be exploited, it needs to be fixed.

You are proposing workhouses for those less fortunate.

I find that somewhat offensive. I went to boarding school and generally speaking found my accommodation perfectly acceptable. So you think my accommodation as a child isn't even good enough for unemployed people?

You are proposing even more segregation of the "have" and the "have-nots" - the deserving and less-deserving.

How?

Scenario. Man with wife and 2 children. Mortgage. Has worked in his current job for the last ten years. He is made redundant. So, you are expecting him to leave his home and move to a workhouse environment with his wife and children?

I can't believe you think there is no lack of jobs it might be an idea for you to research current job to person ratio - you will soon see there is a distinct lack of jobs.

The overseas workers will work for less money, hence why my local Asda took a good percentage on, and basically refused the locals the jobs.

Since this country has minimum wage, it is impossible for migrant workers to LEGALLY work for less money. The only reason this would be the case is because the locals refuse to work at that level. It is perfectly possible to live comfortably on minimum wage in most parts of the UK (London being the main exception).

Where I live, contracts are ZERO hours and 95 percent of the very few jobs there are, are for NMW.

What's wrong with minimum wage? It's easily enough for 1 and possibly for 2. As a student I lived on much less.

I think you need to hit some unemployment black spots to get a good idea of the current problems. Many businesses have folded and thousands of people have lost their jobs since the recession. A lot have lost their homes too.

Obviously some areas are harder hit than others, but the national average is not so extreme.

What about the disabled? Should they be forced to live together in a workhouse environment too?

Do you want them to live in such environments? Perhaps they should live with their families? I don't know! The issues with the disabled are completely separate to unemployment and the abuse of the benefit system by perfectly healthy people.

Randvegeta

Another point to note.

I do not currently take a salary which makes me 'unemployed' (kind of).

I am probably entitled to a number of benefits. Were I to actually claim any of these, would that be okay?

If a system can be exploited, the 'loop holes' need to be locked down as much as possible.

I choose not to exploit the system. I rather be part of the solution, not the problem! But if you all don't think there is a problem, then I suppose I should go and start claiming as much as I can!

dickydonkin

I don't exploit the system. I am a British national but was born
overseas.

We do things differently here - many could believe that is what attracted you or your family to these shores in the first place.

If your posts are to be believed, it seems that you have done well out of this country whose systems you deride, (although I concede there are serious flaws which I have never disputed) however, if you are unhappy at the way things are here in the UK, there is an alternative option available for you.

Many on these boards may come to the conclusion that perhaps because of your views, your country of birth has a better welfare system in place (assuming there is one) which may be more compatable to your views and opinions which some people could perceive as being selfish and arrogant.

I couldn't possibly comment of course and I will keep my own cousel.

I am probably entitled to a number of benefits. Were I to actually claim any of these, would that be okay?

You are now becoming silly - you need to get to bed earlier..........Or the white cider is too strong!

I think you are just a wind up merchant - and I have been foolish enough to bite - bye!

Randvegeta

dickydonkin wrote: »

We do things differently here - many could believe that is what attracted you or your family to these shores in the first place.

Aha.. I did I forget to mention I was BORN British? My family are British. My Dad was born in the UK (if it makes a difference, he's a white English). I would have to say what attracted my family to these shores would be the fact it was my father's birth place. Good enough for you? Certainly not the 'different way of doing things' theory you have.

If your posts are to be believed, it seems that you have done well out of this country whose systems you deride, (although I concede there are serious flaws which I have never disputed) however, if you are unhappy at the way things are here in the UK, there is an alternative option available for you.

I was raised mostly outside of the UK. I have have attended private school here and University. How do you figure I've 'done well out of this country'?

Many on these boards may come to the conclusion that perhaps because of your views, your country of birth has a better welfare system in place (assuming there is one) which may be more compatable to your views and opinions which some people could perceive as being selfish and arrogant.

What do you mean 'better'? My (other) country has welfare, just not as generous as the UK's. Healthcare, education, unemployment benefits, pensions, low income housing etc. It's got most of what everyone needs.

The main point is, the UK does not have the money to fund much of the services it provides to its people. There is a HUGE national debt, AND a budget deficit. Conversely, my (other) country has large reserves and budget surprlus. Top that off with low taxes, and you've got a system far superior to the UK. Did I mention quality of life and life expectancy are rated higher too? Oh and the GDP per capita (PPP) is some 50% higher despite having a comparable nominal GDP per capita?

I couldn't possibly comment of course and I will keep my own cousel.

Perhaps you will find the information provided above useful then.

You are now becoming silly - you need to get to bed earlier..........Or the white cider is too strong!

I think you are just a wind up merchant - and I have been foolish enough to bite - bye!

Bye!

Anubis_2

dickydonkin wrote: »

We do things differently here - many could believe that is what attracted you or your family to these shores in the first place.

If your posts are to be believed, it seems that you have done well out of this country whose systems you deride, (although I concede there are serious flaws which I have never disputed) however, if you are unhappy at the way things are here in the UK, there is an alternative option available for you.

Many on these boards may come to the conclusion that perhaps because of your views, your country of birth has a better welfare system in place (assuming there is one) which may be more compatable to your views and opinions which some people could perceive as being selfish and arrogant.

I couldn't possibly comment of course and I will keep my own cousel.
E


You are now becoming silly - you need to get to bed earlier..........Or the white cider is too strong!

I think you are just a wind up merchant - and I have been foolish enough to bite - bye!

Hit - Nail - Head.

The poster has an I'm alright jack attitude from their ivory tower. The reference to "it's good enough for people on holiday," holds little water, since a holiday is a very short term temporary situation.

Private boarding school holds little water too. I will stop there

Randvegeta

Hit - Nail - Head.

The poster has an I'm alright jack attitude from their ivory tower. The reference to "it's good enough for people on holiday," holds little water, since a holiday is a very short term temporary situation.

Private boarding school holds little water too. I will stop there

I have no idea what point this has.

My point is, if you are living off the state (and thus the tax payer), it should not be as comfortable as living off minimum wage.

I have suggested boarding type accommodation as I personally find this an acceptable place to live given it is free!

Your 'short term holiday' comment does not apply to boarding school since school boarders can often stay for entire terms.

Also, unemployment should never be considered as a long term position to be in. Right?

Perhaps instead of simply shooting down the ideas I put forward, come up with another solution.

What we have now, is a mess.

But like I said, perhaps I will start seeking some benefits that I am entitled to. After all, it seems you all think it is a perfectly acceptable practice. If I am entitled, weather I need it or not, its all good! Right?

Oh, Anubis, SG1 fan by any chance? Do you want to enslave large populations to do your bidding?

Anubis_2

No idea what an SG1 fan is? .....

Not going to respond to the rest.

dandelionclock30

Randvegeta wrote: »

I have no idea what point this has.

My point is, if you are living off the state (and thus the tax payer), it should not be as comfortable as living off minimum wage.

I have suggested boarding type accommodation as I personally find this an acceptable place to live given it is free!

Your 'short term holiday' comment does not apply to boarding school since school boarders can often stay for entire terms.

Also, unemployment should never be considered as a long term position to be in. Right?

Perhaps instead of simply shooting down the ideas I put forward, come up with another solution.

What we have now, is a mess.

But like I said, perhaps I will start seeking some benefits that I am entitled to. After all, it seems you all think it is a perfectly acceptable practice. If I am entitled, weather I need it or not, its all good! Right?

Oh, Anubis, SG1 fan by any chance? Do you want to enslave large populations to do your bidding?

.

1) Boarding type accomodation whether it it a school or a hostel isnt free. At boarding schoools parents tend to pay, unless a child wins a scholarship. Hostels are paid for by the individual if on holiday.

2) If you've got your own company and are not drawing a wage because you wish to evade tax then you are not entitled to benefits. Your making a choice to refuse being paid.
You dont want to end up getting done for benefit fraud!

3) Your comments are just silly and dont even stand up or make sence.

Randvegeta

No idea what an SG1 fan is? .....

Not going to respond to the rest.

That was a joke. Anubis was a character on a TV show, Stargate SG1. He was a system lord who enslaved many humans by making them believe he was an all powerful god.

1) Boarding type accomodation whether it it a school or a hostel isnt free. At boarding schoools parents tend to pay, unless a child wins a scholarship. Hostels are paid for by the individual if on holiday.

I never said boarding or hostels were free. I'm saying that state provided benefits are effectively free. I hope you don't come to the wrong conclusion in the real world so often as you have in replying to my posts on this thread.

2) If you've got your own company and are not drawing a wage because you wish to evade tax then you are not entitled to benefits. Your making a choice to refuse being paid.

Wrong again. Tax evasion is ILLEGAL! I do not evade taxes. What I do is lawful. My company pays all the tax due in it's respective jurisdiction. I am avoiding tax by not drawing a salary. Nothing wrong with this. I'm not sure what the exact entitlements are (if any) but the fact I own a company is of little consequence. Own any shares in company? I don't owning shares excludes you from being entitled to unemployment and low income benefits.

And yes it may be choice, but so is it the choice of many to refuse to take certain jobs because they believe it is BELOW them. For example, a chemistry/pharmacy graduate may wish to take up employment in a field relevant to their degree. If such jobs are not available, they may well go on JSA and whatever other benefits an unemployed person may be eligible for. If the only work available is a factory worker, or toilet cleaner, or chip frier, and they DON'T take it. This is a choice! They have chosen NOT to work.

You dont want to end up getting done for benefit fraud!

Indeed I don't want to be done for benefit fraud, but why would you say such a thing? 1. I don't claim any form of benefit. 2. What fraud would be committed were I to apply?

3) Your comments are just silly and dont even stand up or make sence.

As opposed to yours which make perfect sense and arn't silly at all yes?

As I understand, you are in support of the welfare state, in support of people receiving benefits even if they choose not to work when work is available. Yet somehow my lawful actions to avoid tax is not acceptable to you, and my desire to change the system angers you in some way.

I thought this country was supposed to be tolerant. With people like you here, it's no wonder we are all going down hill.

dandelionclock30

I think your being deliberatley inflammatory and silly to get a reaction.Im not responding again.