When Austerity Meets Reality

Going4TheDream

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

Graham....

You really, really, really need to learn to look at the bigger picture.

We have Nazi's being elected into modern European parliaments, !!!!!!.

Austerity, at this moment in time, is demonstrably the very thing that is not working.


Once again, there is no price too high to pay in order to prevent a re-run of the 1930's in Europe.

The Nazi's/extreme right parties are on the rise as they despise not only Europe and its interference, but also immigration particularly stemming from Islamophobia.

If we didnt have 'austerity' can you be so sure that the far right parties would disappear overnight?

I am not so sure they would

Thrugelmir

thescouselander wrote: »

Personally I am unconvinced austerity measures will fix the problems we face. It will be interesting to see what happens.

You may well be right. If you are then things can only be worse. :eek:

As there's no illusion, this is reality. The seriousness of which many wish to gloss over.

Graham_Devon

Please don't hang on to the nazi thing to avoid all questions on how your spending measures would actually work.

HAMISH_MCTAVISH

Going4TheDream wrote: »

The Nazi's/extreme right parties are on the rise as they despise not only Europe and its interference, but also immigration particularly stemming from Islamophobia.

If we didnt have 'austerity' can you be so sure that the far right parties would disappear overnight?

I am not so sure they would

Racism and xenophobia exist under the surface of any and every society.

But it's poverty and desperation which allow them to spread like a cancer into mainstream politics.

Golden Dawn, which meets under a flag of an ancient Greek symbol similar to the swastika, has won over many of Greece's poor by giving away clothes and food parcels.

Straight out of the 1930's.... It was economic pain then with the reparations agreed to at the treaty of Versailles which allowed the Nazi party into power.

In the last month we've had the government fall in Greece, France, Romania and Holland.

Austerity without growth is dead as a political concept.

Thrugelmir

CLAPTON wrote: »

let's remind ourselves that after the war the UK had debts of 250% of gdp

we started on a period of social change (NHS, education etc) and also a period of unprecedented economic growth and full employment

The welfare state was created in an era where life expectancy was a totally different matter. We live in a very different world now.

The Western world is being crippled by welfare systems that are simply unsustainable.

Going4TheDream

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

Racism and xenophobia exist under the surface of any and every society.

But it's poverty and desperation which allow them to spread like a cancer into mainstream politics.

Is anyone surprised?


This is precisely what happens when you shut out democracy, just as the EU and its constituent governments are doing.

These activists are largely out of sight of mainstream politicians, but they are motivated, active, and growing in size.

Politicians across the continent need to sit up, listen and respond, were no lessons learnt from the 30's and the 2nd world war?

That said when the economy falters the goverment would rather we all picked on each other rather than pick on them

macaque_2

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

With all the focus on abstract economic theories, much is forgotten about reality.
Political reality in particular.
Austerity without growth was never going to be politically sustainable. And that which is unsustainable, cannot be sustained.
And lest we forget just how much more is at stake than a paltry few percent on some investment return somewhere.
All starting to sound a tad too familiar....
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/world/bitter-pill-europeans-wont-take/story-e6frg6ux-1226347229072

More public spending will just make things worse. The problem is that we have unproductive economies as a result of high taxes and powerful groups protecting their interests.

• If rents were to fall by 50%, our labour costs would immediately go down by between 10 and 25%
• If the whole compensation claims industry were put up against a wall and shot, companies would start taking risks again. Through risk comes growth.
• If high taxes and red tape were demolished, companies might start investing in the UK again instead of sitting on cash mountains.

Thrugelmir

Originally Posted by HAMISH_MCTAVISH
Austerity without growth was never going to be politically sustainable.

That's a problem for the politicians and why techocrats (people with a degree of financial common sense) are being called in to rebalance the books.

Zorz_2

Going4TheDream wrote: »

The Nazi's/extreme right parties are on the rise as they despise not only Europe and its interference, but also immigration particularly stemming from Islamophobia.

If we didnt have 'austerity' can you be so sure that the far right parties would disappear overnight? I am not so sure they would

The first part is correct. As for the second, take a look at this.

Chrysi Aygi (Golden Dawn) went from 0.29% in October 2009 to 6.97% yesterday. What happened in Greece in the meantime? Did the neonazi, remnants of the Colonels' junta, royalists and fascists suddenly perfected human cloning?

vivatifosi

Zorz wrote: »

The first part is correct. As for the second, take a look at this.

Chrysi Aygi (Golden Dawn) went from 0.29% in October 2009 to 6.97% yesterday. What happened in Greece in the meantime? Did the neonazi, remnants of the Colonels' junta, royalists and fascists suddenly perfected human cloning?

Zorz, if I recall correctly you're here from Greece. What do your relatives (presumably some are still there) think about the country? Do they worry for the future? It's good to have someone around with first-hand experience btw.