Do you HAVE to accept a warning?

StudioBeau

We don't have anyone sign warnings - they do have to sign the notes from the investigation and subsequent disciplinary meeting, but what they are agreeing to is that it is a true account of what was said - not that they agree with the outcome. If they do not agree with the outcome, they have to write a letter, therefore accepting that they have a warning. If the manager said 'I am issuing you with a written warning' and they agree that was said, that is not them accepting the warning but it is admitting they heard it said to them and then saw it written down.

So, no, you can't refuse to accept a warning because it is not the warning you are accepting when you sign notes. It is accepting that was said. You then appeal the warning that was given to you.

MrSnuggles

Sambucus_Nigra wrote: »

Does it? It seems to me that they have just given him a warning for arguing. How exactly do you jump from getting a warning to being pressurised into leaving?

Exactly my thought. The duration of that person staying with the company, what the argument was about, and if management were aware is all irrelevant. Simply taking part in the argument instead of working is. If you don't get along with someone then it's your problem. You can't blame management and say they should done something to make your life easier.

This attitude and reasoning won't stand in any Employment Tribunal.

MissSarah1972

Sambucus_Nigra wrote: »

How do you know they got it if there were no witnesses?

That would be because they gave it to me. Came up to my desk and handed me an envelope without saying anything and walked away.

clive12

buel wrote: »

Hi,
Quick question- my friend thinks he is likely to receive a warning from his employer for allowing himself to get into an argument with a colleague who his employers repeatedly put to work with my friend knowing full well that they dont get on.
My friend wants to know, do you HAVE to accept a warning from your employer if you dont agree with it?

if the warning is for arguing not accepting it and arguing wont do you many favors.

its not the employers place to sort out the fact that members of staff dont like each other as its a place of work not a school playground.

if the employer wants to be difficult about it then they can do and right or wrong they could be out of a job.

i would accept it graciously and not rise to the bait of the other staff member.

Sambucus_Nigra

MissSarah1972 wrote: »

That would be because they gave it to me. Came up to my desk and handed me an envelope without saying anything and walked away.

Well then - you know that you can get a warning without having to sign anything then!

Did they not have a disciplinary meeting with you prior to handing you a warning?

DCodd

MrSnuggles wrote: »

Exactly my thought. The duration of that person staying with the company, what the argument was about, and if management were aware is all irrelevant. Simply taking part in the argument instead of working is. If you don't get along with someone then it's your problem. You can't blame management and say they should done something to make your life easier.

This attitude and reasoning won't stand in any Employment Tribunal.

I'm sorry but that is wrong. The environment in which you work and many other factors are relevant. There are times when employers allow heated exchanges, especially at the formulation stage. If this is a comon event then arguing may well be working, if the argument was about work then how can that not be a working scenario. If it is common place within the environment then the employee should be able to rely on the "confidence" that the employer views such actions as an acceptable working practise.

Certainly in the construction environment in which I work an employer would be hard pressed to defend disciplinary action for arguing as it is very common and on a daily basis.

As I said we do not know enough detail and we are just speculating.

Googlewhacker

andygb wrote: »

Absolutely correct. Everyone seems to be assuming that it is the person in question who is at fault - he may well be, but we DO NOT KNOW!
We also have no idea how long he has worked there, what his work record was prior to this incident, and whether or not the management were aware that he did not get on with the other person.
If we take the facts presented at face value, then it would seem that the company wish to pressurise him into leaving. If this is the case, then there are various courses which the employee could take prior to considering whether or not to resign, and one of these is consulting an employment lawyer.

Now you are the one assuming!

buel

Hi all.
Thanks for the many comments.
To be brief as i can, my friend works on a factory floor in an engineering firm. There are arguments between employees most days consisting of industrial language, nothing major but then neither was this one.

My friend became frustrated at his colleague's constant mistakes whilst sharing the same job. This has happened before and it was well known to everyone that they two do not get on due to the colleague constantly making mistakes The colleague then began shouting at my friend and my friend said something similar to 'Working with you is like working with a sapling', meaning the colleague was 'green' and untrained. The team leader of the pair heard this and reported it to the factory manager (instead of intervening and calming the situation- just my opinion).

Today, after both employees attended a disciplinary meeting seperately, both with their union rep (the same one, rather oddly), the colleague received a warning that 'bumped' him up to his final written warning and was moved to a different area to work and my friend is to receive a warning by letter tomorrow.

I should mention two things:
1, In the past two years, another employee who punched his team leader only received a warning.
2, 5 weeks ago one employee (known to have mental health issues) walked into another employee's area of work and shoved him for no reason whatsoever and then repeatedly 'offered him outside'. When this was reported to the same manager who dealt with today's disciplinary meeting, the manager took no action whatsoever. The employee with the mental health issues had done the same thing to another employee two months previous and received a verbal warning.
The employee with mental health issues admitted both incidents.

So you can see why my friend is feeling a bit put out?
The union rep suggested appealing once the warning has been given.

I understand that these details may sound incredulous but i have no reason to lie.

I suppose my question is, is the fact that the employers took no action against the employee with mental issues relevant to my friend's case/situation? Ie-, can he use it as grounds for appeal?

Savvy_Sue

buel wrote: »

Today, after both employees attended a disciplinary meeting seperately, both with their union rep (the same one, rather oddly),

That's not necessarily odd, IMO. It's not like a solicitor: the union rep isn't there to sort out the rights and wrongs of the situation, but to support the employee.

After all, the other employee was also put to work with someone they don't get on with, and that may have been a contributory factor!

Torry_Quine

buel wrote: »

Hi all.




I should mention two things:
1, In the past two years, another employee who punched his team leader only received a warning.
2, 5 weeks ago one employee (known to have mental health issues) walked into another employee's area of work and shoved him for no reason whatsoever and then repeatedly 'offered him outside'. When this was reported to the same manager who dealt with today's disciplinary meeting, the manager took no action whatsoever. The employee with the mental health issues had done the same thing to another employee two months previous and received a verbal warning.
The employee with mental health issues admitted both incidents.

So you can see why my friend is feeling a bit put out?
The union rep suggested appealing once the warning has been given.

I understand that these details may sound incredulous but i have no reason to lie.

I suppose my question is, is the fact that the employers took no action against the employee with mental issues relevant to my friend's case/situation? Ie-, can he use it as grounds for appeal?

He can't use the other instances as every case is looked at individually.