Recycling - thoughts

Itismehonest

We were goody 2 shoes long before our local council started recycling (we ran a holiday cottage complex so encouraged all our visitors to recycle & then took the things to the local centre ourselves) so are very much in favour of doing what we can.

It was an eye-opener into how other countries take for granted that most of their rubbish could be recycled even back then. Some were amazed what we couldn't recycle particularly in the way of plastics.

Our recycling is now collected weekly but we only have a fortnightly bin collection.
I find it really frustrating that something which is taken one week can be chucked back the next because even the guys collecting don't seem to know what they can or can't take.
I think that, until councils are in a position to recycle all the 'recyclable' items, they shouldn't even consider charging people extra if those people would recycle even more but the councils themselves are forcing them to bin stuff.

ani*fan

We have reduced packaging as much as possible and reuse everything we can. All extra gets burned on the fire so we don;t have a rubbish bin collection.

However, even though we use jute bags, plastic bags still end up in our home somehow. How? Not sure except that when people give us things they often come in a carrier. (MiL and her box of teabags and other stuff she brings round.) Carrier bags are like an epidemic.

Ben84

I think yes, why not? It's the total amounts that matter, rather than how you use it.

I don't recycle, I have significant doubts about the benefits and find the different bin days confusing and previous attempts have just ended up with piles of rubbish building up and the bins out on all the wrong days and general frustrations. It seems that every recycle bin goes out on a different day and the list of exceptions is endless. The landfill bin is the one that thankfully never changes, so I rely on that. However, I don't throw away that much stuff really either. Using less is much more important I believe than recycling.

jwil

tru wrote: »

Do the carrier bags compost when they're buried? I read that they only break down in sunlight and will last as long as a normal carrier when they're buried. I can't find a definitive answer.

No they don't compost in a landfill site. If they break down they break down anaerobically which creates methane - far worse for the environment than carbon dioxide.

The compostable bags are only any good if you compost them. Biodegradable plastics are the same - a complete waste of time. If you put your compostable or biodegradable bag in a carrier bag recycling point, it can potentially ruin the whole load. No manufacturer will want to use recycled plastic that is likely to start breaking down.

If you litter your degradable bag, you aren't helping the environment either. The bag may break down, but still takes up to 3 years to do so, and then it breaks down into millions of pieces that can still be ingested by and harm wildlife.

If the bag you are using is ultimately going to end up in landfill then just use a normal plastic one - it will sit there and not break down, but it won't cause harmful emissions!

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/bills/article-1621193/The-myth-of-biodegradable-plastic-bags.html

EricMears

jwil wrote: »

No they don't compost in a landfill site. If they break down they break down anaerobically which creates methane - far worse for the environment than carbon dioxide.

Not quite the disaster suggested - many landfill sites (though alas not all !) collect methane and use to e.g. generate electricty.

But I agree with the general point that it's better not to send anything to landill if there's something better to do with it.

Ben84

EricMears wrote: »

Not quite the disaster suggested - many landfill sites (though alas not all !) collect methane and use to e.g. generate electricty.

But I agree with the general point that it's better not to send anything to landill if there's something better to do with it.

Sending stuff to landfill seems like a bad end for things, but it's really a matter of determining if the energy consumed to recover something and turn it in to another item is less than the energy used to make this same item from new materials. This is sometimes true and other times not true. Recycling can save energy and it can waste it. Plastics and paper are often suspect on this point I've found, while aluminium is often worth recycling. Energy isn't the full picture however, some materials may be worth saving as they're scarce. There's little point spending energy to recycle glass when sand is so abundant for example, but recycling valuable rare metals may be worth spending more energy on as the supply of them is limited. That's not concluding it's environmentally sound however, that's more of a rational choice to benefit us. Burning some more oil to recover waste platinum is good for us as we have a lot more oil than platinum.

My conclusion however is that sometimes landfill is the environmentally sound option, depending on the material and energy intensiveness of the collection service for it. Simply avoiding waste however negatives the whole question, so reusable items are best. Changing to lightweight packaging, like the new plastic coffee bags that replace bulky glass jars, which are really not worth material recovery as they weigh a couple of grams at most, also makes mixed waste landfill a more sensible option for this kind of waste. It's better to make less items and make items with less materials in them in the first place than it is to try and recover them endlessly from people's rubbish.

Conclusions may vary on this I'm sure, but I think it's good to question the idea recycling is always beneficial with numbers on how the two routes compare and on rational choices about which materials are more valuable to us than others.

EricMears

Ben84 wrote: »

Sending stuff to landfill seems like a bad end for things

It doesn't actually have to be 'the end'.

There are many examples of 'dumped material' being rescued.

e.g. waste from lead workings in the Peak District is often sorted to recover fluorspar

it's quite common to rework colliery waste and extract a low grade fuel

household waste from Victorian London has been recovered and used as a filler for clay used in the brick making process

etc. . .

Norman_Castle

From Freecycle recently

OFFER: 1000+used supermarket carrier bags I have collected 1000+ carrier bags over the last couple of years from
various trips to the supermarket. Could be us full to carbooter etc if
you want , must be collected by Sunday night or will be put out with
the recyling,

Why not just reuse them. Surely when heading towards having 1000+ plastic bags they would realise how wasteful they are. At least they are trying to recycle them, or possibly have no room left in their bin. Bring on the plastic bag tax.

grahamc2003

I'm always amazed at the amount of food which is reported as wasted - around 30% iirc. It certainly isn't from us, where practically no food is thrown out. Apparently some people throw out food once it's near it's sell by date, which to my mind is madness (and obscene imv).

Anything not edible by us either goes to our dog or to our chickens to be recycled as eggs. I must put a word in for these 'kitchen caddy' things, for vegetable waste like coiffee grounds and potato peelings etc. I was dubious as to their smellyness at first, but having used one for 2 years now (for veg waste as an interim step before it goes in the compost bin) I'd say there's no smell at all. Gets a little gunky and messy inside, but no smells on the outside, so fine for the kitchen.

I'm not really motivated by 'green' reasons, just seems sensible to make compost and eggs from waste, and also minimise waste production anyhow. Any cardboard and paper (and old books too far gone to give to charity shops) get burnt in the woodburner. Usually our normal waste bins just have food wrapping/ expanded polystyrene from box packaging.

What gets my goat is food packaging which all supermarkets are guilty of, hoiwever 'green' their claims. Pizzas seem more multi layered packaging than pizza - just one example. I occasionally like a Big Mac (horror of horrors) - but the amount of bulky packing to allow me plus 4 others to carry it 5 yards is simply perverse - but I expect there may be health and safety regs which force the situation (are there?). Mutliply that by how many burgers are sold each day and the stupidity and waste are immense.

Ben84

EricMears wrote: »

It doesn't actually have to be 'the end'.

There are many examples of 'dumped material' being rescued.

e.g. waste from lead workings in the Peak District is often sorted to recover fluorspar

it's quite common to rework colliery waste and extract a low grade fuel

household waste from Victorian London has been recovered and used as a filler for clay used in the brick making process

etc. . .

Interesting examples and point, the materials aren't gone. I know sometimes landfills are dug up for the materials they contain. I believe the landfill near Tel Aviv was dug up for soil and metal years ago. However, there's issues with contamination and the types of things we throw away that might make that less popular today. Sometimes landfills once full have other things built on top of them too, so the land isn't completely used up in all cases. I've seen parks and golf courses that have landfills under them. Building heavy structures on them might be a challenge however.