Bankruptcy Nightmare - Abroad PART 2

SeniorUnit1

I recently posted about trying to go BK abroad. The outcome was I actually applied for BK, however my case was looked at but due to complications the hearing was set back until June this year. This apparently is a rare occurrence.
Anyhow, I got word from the judge and they have said they realise and understand my difficulties and the situation however new rules with the COMI are complicating the issue. He did not dismiss the case and he has given me three more months to prove my best interests were in the UK at the time of applying. I moved from the UK on the 2nd Jan... when I applied for BK I was in the UK for more than three months, this can be proved. I have registered with the Alien Police, I have contracts proving this my location times etc. However I now live and work outside the UK but within the EU and this is being classed as my COMI. I have one more chance to prove my case, however my solicitor said they have done what they can do to prove and nothing more can be done. I personally want to fight because I have one last chance and the judge has given me this chance for a reason. Also it was said that he did not want to waste my money in applying for BK, this is also another reason why he has given me chance to prove myself. How can i convince him?....

So all i can see is the following options...please help...

So one option is definite, I will try again in June. but how do i convince him, hes given me another chance for some reason and believe it’s because he can see the difficulty ?

I will not move bk to the UK, I have life and work here.

I have a house now, I cannot sell, and I cannot rent as the lender will not let me and the house is in negative equity.

Ive tried to speak with them but they repeat to me I cannot sell or rent the property. Specially as im in negative equity, and have some arrears of 200....(wow)

So i stopped paying the mortgage. This is a shame because i have people in there renting it and that rent money covers the mortgage, even though im not supposed to be renting. (i have insurance & gas cert etc.)

The mortgage is 120.000, the house had one offer of 110,000, it will sell between 100,000-110,000. I dont mind paying the shortfall off of a sale, again the lenders won’t let me.

So if i hand back the keys how likely is it that they will change their mind and let me sell for a lower price?. surely it better for them than let it go to auction after a repossession?

At the moment I have one late mortgage payment, and i have said i will pay them next month. They cannot call me anymore because i don’t have a phone, again i do receive my post thro my parents.

What on earth do I do?

I pay them the mortgage and cannot sell until the house is in equity, but i can only do this by letting people rent, but im not allowed to.

Stop paying them all let them chase me for the money, but surely ill end up paying about 30-40k back for nothing? is it likely that a repossession auction will sell for 40% of the market value?

Tell them im going to stop paying and see if they come to a conclusion?...Surely they will just send the debt collectors around, im not hard to find in the EU. And they send them around and i cant pay them either?. they take me to court and i pay them £1 a month...

If i go bankrupt here in the EU then it will damage my new start.

And the other party on the mortgage wen to Australia 4 years.. they are still responsible for the other half of the mortgage also.

Im so stuck i cannot see the lgith at the moment.

Anyone’s help is appreciated.

silvercar

The mortgage is 120.000, the house had one offer of 110,000, it will sell between 100,000-110,000. I dont mind paying the shortfall off of a sale, again the lenders won’t let me

If you can clear the balance owed at the time of the sale, the lender has to remove the charge. It is unclear whether you mean that you have the money to clear the balance or that you are happy to take an unsecured loan with the lender. If you have enough money to pay the legal costs of the sale, the estate agents fees and the balance owed on the mortgage with the sale money (including any arrears at the time of sale), then go for it.

SeniorUnit1

silvercar wrote: »

If you can clear the balance owed at the time of the sale, the lender has to remove the charge. It is unclear whether you mean that you have the money to clear the balance or that you are happy to take an unsecured loan with the lender. If you have enough money to pay the legal costs of the sale, the estate agents fees and the balance owed on the mortgage with the sale money (including any arrears at the time of sale), then go for it.

No I dont have the money, im mean that I will come to an arrangement after the sale to clear the shortfort, monthly payments etc.

debtinfo

unfortunatly, as i said in the previous thread you are in a bit of a grey area and it seems the judge is having difficulty giving a strong verdict as to your COMI as well, As you are living abroad permenantly now it is unlikely to go further in your favour.

Did the judge seem to indicate that

1) he agreed in your COMI being in the UK, but wants you to evidence that(ie prove what you are saying is correct)

2) that he did not feel that the reasons given for your COMI being in the UK were good enough and needs further reasons.

presumably if it is 2) than that is not likely to happen as i presume that you have already given him all the facts of the case already.

if it is 1) then it is more helpfull, if he agrees in principle then you should be able to find the evidence for it


As far as the property goes, all you can do is ask the lender but in my experience as bonkers as it sounds if you cant clear the valance on the day of sale then many lenders wont release their charge and let you pay later, which as you say inevitably leads to a bigger loss in the long run

Your only other option is bankruptcy in the country you now live in

silvercar

SeniorUnit1 wrote: »

No I dont have the money, im mean that I will come to an arrangement after the sale to clear the shortfort, monthly payments etc.

The lender is unlikely to go for that.

Living abroad means they are going to be less clean, harder to chase you if you default.

SeniorUnit1

debtinfo wrote: »

unfortunatly, as i said in the previous thread you are in a bit of a grey area and it seems the judge is having difficulty giving a strong verdict as to your COMI as well, As you are living abroad permenantly now it is unlikely to go further in your favour.

Did the judge seem to indicate that

1) he agreed in your COMI being in the UK, but wants you to evidence that(ie prove what you are saying is correct)

2) that he did not feel that the reasons given for your COMI being in the UK were good enough and needs further reasons.

presumably if it is 2) than that is not likely to happen as i presume that you have already given him all the facts of the case already.

if it is 1) then it is more helpfull, if he agrees in principle then you should be able to find the evidence for it


As far as the property goes, all you can do is ask the lender but in my experience as bonkers as it sounds if you cant clear the valance on the day of sale then many lenders wont release their charge and let you pay later, which as you say inevitably leads to a bigger loss in the long run

Your only other option is bankruptcy in the country you now live in

I believe in his words he wanted convincing more that the COMI was in the UK. (power of attoruney said this to me).

she says its useless, im goign to possibly write a finall letter explaining everything and hope for the best.

The mortgage company are a waste of time, I may aswell just give it all up. Ive faught for years to do it the right way now I think giving them the keys backs the best option.

Either that or pay the mortage form the tennants and throw money away.

SeniorUnit1

silvercar wrote: »

The lender is unlikely to go for that.

Living abroad means they are going to be less clean, harder to chase you if you default.

Im not sure how hard i will e to find.... i registered with the Alien police the other day. So surely they will send the nastys aroudn get the money. I rent in the country im in now and i do not own a thing, bar this old computer... so what can they do?... seriously anyone what can they do?.....

The other party will also be ressposible.. and ive sent her address details and location in australia to the mortgage company.


thanks again guys I appreciate your time

SeniorUnit1

Has anyone applied for bankruptcy within in another EU country other than britain?

silvercar

The other party will also be ressposible.. and ive sent her address details and location in australia to the mortgage company.

They will chase both and hone in on whoever they think has money.

Generally, they realise you must have no money or you wouldn't have been repossessed. So there is little point chasing you until you are back on your feet. Their aim is to get you to make regular payments to service the debt, rather than beat you up. They wont be able to quantify the debt until the property is sold, so don't expect anything to happen soon.

SeniorUnit1

silvercar wrote: »

They will chase both and hone in on whoever they think has money.

Generally, they realise you must have no money or you wouldn't have been repossessed. So there is little point chasing you until you are back on your feet. Their aim is to get you to make regular payments to service the debt, rather than beat you up. They wont be able to quantify the debt until the property is sold, so don't expect anything to happen soon.

Aye.....but it will come.. and when it does ill be in trouble?

alastairq

Aye.....but it will come.. and when it does ill be in trouble?

not in a serious way, at elast.

If you have no assets, no surplus income, what can they do?

I suspect they will pursue until it is [legally] obvious nothing will be re-paid....then they can off-set the apparent debt against tax.

Whilst the debt is 'live', they cannot do that.