Take my current employer to a tribunal (LONG)

Feisty_Fairy

Hi all,

I really need some advice as i dont know where i stand, this is a long one so i will apologise in advance.

I will start from the beginning.

I have worked in the sales department for my company for 3 years (pharmaceutical company). I recently had a bit of a disagreement with the MD due to him not paying me bonus that i had earned fair and square, he even had data changed to make it look like i was a day late hitting target. I told him i wasnt stupid and not to insult my intelligence!:mad:

Anyway since this happened i have been looking for alternate employment and was considering taking them to a tribunal for constructive dismissal.

Here are my reasons

Approx 12 months ago we were put into mini teams and i was paired with an external rep, things went down hill from that point because at the same time the rep who was my partner had a applied for the sales manager position and had been unsuccessful, so he took an instant dislike to the new manager and things just went from bad to worse. He basically didnt pull his weight and spent the majority of his time moaning about being let donw by his company cos he didnt get the job, he also had a bad time with his OH so regularly let that get in the way of work but also admitted to me that he was on one occasion drunk whe supposed to be out on territory!:eek:

I didnt go to management for quite some time as i consider myself to be a fair person and wanted to give him the benefit of the doubt and work through his problems, but it got to the point that we were consistantly not hitting targets (some had been hit without his help but he still got some bonus!). So i told my manager that somthing needed to be done. However it seemed that they had been watching him for some time anyway and had reasons of their own (territory mismanagent and bad admin etc)to pull him in for a warning.

So they did, and he appealed and threatened them with a tribunal and they dropped the warning immediately!:eek:

The sales not being great was mentioned in my appraisal and all the bad stuff was recorded, and although they agreed that i had done a great job and worked hard to keep the area going this was not put on record.

My problem now is they are threatenig us (Us 4 in the office) with redundancy. The plan was to resize down to 2 rather than 4 and one person would be moved over to the generic division and therefore only one redundancy would be required.

All 4 of us applied for the position in generic.

Myself and another lady have been there 3 years, one lady has been there 2 and half years and the last lady 18months.

The lady who has been there the least amount of time and also in all our opinions the poorest in terms of performance and professionalism has been given the generic position (we think with a little help from our managaer whom she is VERY friendly with if you get my meaning).:eek:

So because she is out of the equasion so to speak that means that one of us 3 will go, and its being done on a points sytem to decide who will go, all based on performance for 2006!!!!! So basically due to the afore mentioned i am basically out the door next friday!!!

SO what i need to know is do i have any case whatsoever? I dont think i can do constructive dismissal as i am now being made redundant rather than resigning!

Any advice will be greatly received as i am going out of my mind with worry, and i am crying as i type this as i am feeling so sick with worry and am at my wits end!

Regards

Feisty!

welshnige

Firstly I wish you all the best in how the outcome is. I'm afraid from my point of view of reading that you have no case for a tribunial. If there was a problem with the outside rep then it should have been bought to managements attention immediately, dont you think it would sound like sour grapes now?
It is obvious that you are not happy with this company nor your position and yet you are good at your job, so why not just cut your losses and run, take the redundancy and find yourself a better job in a more happier enviroment :T

dmg24

I have to agree with welshnige, I cannot identify any factors that would amount to constructive dismissal.

I have worked for several unreasonable employers, and find it best to put it down to a bad experience, and move on. Definitely not as simple as it sounds, but the best for you in the longer term.

Best of luck Feisty_Fairy x

Gabs_3

You don't have a case for unfair dismissal but you may have a case for unfair selection for redundancy. I recommend you check out the ACAS and TUC websites. As you were all under threat of redundancy they should first consider re-deployment - as in the case of the generic post. You can challenge the decision on this if you think it was appointed unfairly. Did you attach your own comments to your appraisal? or keep any record of the problems relating to the colleague who caused the downturn in performance?

It also seems to me that the fact they backed down so easily when your colleague threatened them with tribunal may bode well for you. It doesn't sound like he would have had much of a case. Going on what you've said your position sounds stronger.

Take a look at the sites I've recommended and see what you think.

Another point to remember is that if you're being made redundant you are entitled to reasonable time off WITH PAY to job hunt, prepare for and attend interviews. Make sure you take full advantage of this.

Good luck

Nile

Hello Feisty_Fairy

I'll move your thread to the 'Benefits, Tax Credits & Jobseeking' board.

Hi, Martin’s asked me to post this in these circumstances: I’ve asked Board Guides to move threads if they’ll receive a better response elsewhere(please see this rule) so this post/thread has been moved to another board, where it should get more replies. If you have any questions about this policy please email [EMAIL="abuse@moneysavingexpert.com"]abuse@moneysavingexpert.com[/EMAIL].

Regards

Nile

CFC

Hi Feisty - firstly, learning points...never sign an appraisal unless you really are agreeing with what the manager says. If you disagree, then note your comments before signing or send an email to the manager concerned stating that you disagree with the comments and said so, but were still required to sign it without being able to add your own comments. Keep a copy of the email. You're in sales, which is all about performance. Never allow a poor performance to be documented with your agreement if it isn't true or can't be backed up.

During your consultancy period you should have had a meeting with either a senior manager or HR (usually one or the other) when the options open to you, and what your situation was, was discussed with you. If you feel that the generic job was awarded unfairly, the three of you can ask on what areas of performance she fitted well where the three of you did not. If you have not had an individual meeting, or do not have one before receiving a letter telling you that you will be made redundant, you will be in a better situation. However I assume that the meetings have been held, as you have already been told the selection criteria.

The main problem as I see it is that you've allowed a poor performance to be documented. It will be quite difficult now to dispute it, as it will look to any external observer as if you're seeking to clutch at straws, unless you can produce memos or records or file notes of conversations that you made at the time to prove it was unfair.

The fundamental problem is that it is fairly easy for an unprincipled employer to stitch someone up by deliberately selecting the criteria that they want to use. (speaking here as an employer who would absolutely avoid doing it, but would know how to do it if I wanted to). Even easier when they know it's coming at some point in the future so work towards that stitching up. (poor appraisal, documented conversations about anything negative, whatever) In a way it's understandable, as employers do need to be able to define the criteria for themselves, providing those criteria are lawful. It looks as if they've covered all the bases by using pure performance measures.

It's a very hard situation for you, and I wish you the best of luck for the future.