Is this fraud ? What would you do ?

GrungeMeister

A girl at work has lost her home, unfortunately. Her relationship came to an end suddenly, a very acrimonious separation.

We managed to get her a grant from our union charity of £400 to pay the deposit on her new rented home. That's been paid to her.

But she's now told a colleague that, unusually, her new landlord has now decided not to ask for a deposit on the grounds that her previous landlord has given her impeccable references. So she's now decided just to blow that £400 from the charity on other things.

Of course, some in the factory are now saying that she should pay the money back to the charity. Others are saying that to keep the money would be fraud. There's been a lot of arguing about it.

What do you think ? Should she keep the money or give it back ? And if she keeps it, would that be fraud & could the police become involved ? :eek:

anamenottaken

If this is an official charity they should ask her for a receipt for the deposit money from the landlord. Mind you, very odd behaviour on the part of the landlord whatever the references were.

want-it-all

GrungeMeister wrote: »

A girl at work has lost her home, unfortunately. Her relationship came to an end suddenly, a very acrimonious separation.

We managed to get her a grant from our union charity of £400 to pay the deposit on her new rented home. That's been paid to her.

But she's now told a colleague that, unusually, her new landlord has now decided not to ask for a deposit on the grounds that her previous landlord has given her impeccable references. So she's now decided just to blow that £400 from the charity on other things.

Of course, some in the factory are now saying that she should pay the money back to the charity. Others are saying that to keep the money would be fraud. There's been a lot of arguing about it.

What do you think ? Should she keep the money or give it back ? And if she keeps it, would that be fraud & could the police become involved ? :eek:

She should tell the charity, who should decide whether or not she should repay. If they don't request the money back (which may be unlikely), then her keeping of the money is nobody else's business (unethical, no doubt, but that's about it).

As for 'fraud', it's a double-edged sword. Sounds like it wasn't 'fraud' to begin with, since she was granted - and received - the money in good faith for a specific reason. Is it 'fraud' now? Hmm, I don't know (and I'm thinking purely from a legal, not ethical, perspective).

The likelihood of police, etc. becoming involved is probably slim. Give her the time and opportunity to go about returning the money herself before anyone grasses on her...

DVardysShadow

Much as I don't like what she has done, if she kept the place in good nick, the £400 would go into her pocket at the end of the tenancy and no one would be the least bit bothered. I do think she should have returned the money as soon as she was let off the deposit. Perhaps the girl herself is not telling the whole story?

GrungeMeister

Well, initially we went out of our way to help her, as anyone would if a work colleague was suddenly homeless.

The new landlord DID ask for a deposit to begin with. But seemingly the new landlord knew the previous landlord and decided AFTER the charity had made the award that they didn't need a deposit at all, just a months rent up front (I agree that sounds odd, but that's what she's saying).

Tbh she's been a bit boastful around the factory, saying she's going to book a holiday with the money because she's had such a hard time lately (and she has).

But some of the other girls pay into that charity and are a bit peeved about the whole thing, they're threatening to cancel their subscriptions because "why should they pay for someone else's holiday" ?

I can see it from both sides, tbh. Bit of a mess.

getmore4less

Seems like she atracts issues.

Also seems to be a bit of an idiot boasting about a holiday with this money

What were the terms of the charititable donation, were there any conditions on the use and/or return of the money.

It is normal to pay rent in advance, if this is an extra month ahead that is a kind of deposit and the landlord gets round the deposit protection requirements.

Looks like you may get some other employment issues if she get sent to coventry by the others over this..

Judith_W

It's funny the way this charity operates. Usually they give the deposit as a loan, to be re-paid at a later date when the tenancy is over/ gradually over the course of the rental. I do think from the long term perspective, she would be getting this money anyway... But think the charity should be getting receipts from the landlord and maybe the factory workers should raise this as an issue without mentioning names.

want-it-all

GrungeMeister wrote: »

Well, initially we went out of our way to help her, as anyone would if a work colleague was suddenly homeless.

The new landlord DID ask for a deposit to begin with. But seemingly the new landlord knew the previous landlord and decided AFTER the charity had made the award that they didn't need a deposit at all, just a months rent up front (I agree that sounds odd, but that's what she's saying).

Tbh she's been a bit boastful around the factory, saying she's going to book a holiday with the money because she's had such a hard time lately (and she has).

But some of the other girls pay into that charity and are a bit peeved about the whole thing, they're threatening to cancel their subscriptions because "why should they pay for someone else's holiday" ?

I can see it from both sides, tbh. Bit of a mess.

I'm helping my little sister look for a flat, and there do seem to be a lot of 'no deposit' deals at the moment, from what I can gather. BTL landlords in a bit of pickle, I guess. If landlord is now confident that he has the prospect of a reasonable tenant, deposits can be easily negotiated, or eliminated. So her not having to pay for a deposit is not that unusual. One months' rent in advance is standard, though.

She sounds a bit...silly...to go around bragging, though. Perhaps she has 'issues', she has been having a hard time, as you say.

Given the time she's had (people don't tend to lose their homes over 'nothing'), it might be wise for her to cling onto the £400 for a while in case she finds herself in a further pickle, with rent and such.

It'd be sad for other people to stop contributing to the charity, though. One person's apparent abuse of the system shouldn't work to the detriment of what sounds to be a good scheme overall.

want-it-all

Judith_W wrote: »

It's funny the way this charity operates. Usually they give the deposit as a loan, to be re-paid at a later date when the tenancy is over/ gradually over the course of the rental. I do think from the long term perspective, she would be getting this money anyway... But think the charity should be getting receipts from the landlord and maybe the factory workers should raise this as an issue without mentioning names.

That's my understanding/experience of these things, too. I've come across organisations who have lent much higher 'bonds' to tenants, but it's expressly been granted as a loan. Charities/organisations paying directly to landlords is common, too...

ohreally

Judith_W wrote: »

It's funny the way this charity operates.

So, what charity is this then?