wife's pension fund review - advice needed

jamesd

margaretclare wrote: »

I wonder where the Syrian government is getting all its armaments from, to shell their own people, unarmed civilians, power supplies to babies in incubators?

Mainly Russian arms companies and the Russian government. Haven't researched which of those are available to UK investors, if any. I don't know who makes their electricity distribution circuit breakers. Doubt that many people here would currently want to by Syrian government bonds, the risk level is pretty high.

For an arguably unethical investment someone could also by a FTSE 100 index tracker of FTSE All Share Index tracker. Plenty of arguably unethical companies involved there - tobacco makers, pharmaceutical companies, oil companies, banks.

margaretclare

For a more readily available UK choice you might consider Invesco Perpetual Income, which has a high percentage of tobacco companies.

Thanks for telling me! I obviously hadn't done my research well enough. I've now switched out of Invesco Perpetual Income.

jamesd

Use care with that. All equity income funds in the UK market are likely to have lots of tobacco companies, so your replacement may have no less or even more.

margaretclare

jamesd wrote: »

Use care with that. All equity income funds in the UK market are likely to have lots of tobacco companies, so your replacement may have no less or even more.

Thanks for that. I also have Jupiter Ecology and Kames Ethical (was Aegon). Have switched the Invesco to F&C Stewardship.

I guess you can tell how I feel about tobacco!!!!

jamesd

Yes, I can guess. Happy I ended up being helpful.

atush

I am not big on armaments, but I don't mind tobacco, pharma and oil in my portfolio. Nuclear power seems pretty green to me, if you don't build your plants on fault times or where there are tsunamis.

The whole ethical thing is far too subjective as one persons ethics don't match another's.

margaretclare

The whole ethical thing is far too subjective as one persons ethics don't match another's.

Yes, that's true, so you have to make a careful choice according to your own.

BTW mine is not a pension fund like the OP's wife, it's my S&S ISA. But that started out as a Friends Provident stakeholder a long time ago.

gadgetmind

atush wrote: »

The whole ethical thing is far too subjective as one persons ethics don't match another's.

Agreed.

The law isn't perfect, but I would never criticise someone for investing in something that's legal in the relevant country.

Go to one country and booze is unethical and illegal, go to another and you can't make a profit from lending money, another and you're not allowed to smoke a Cuban cigar. Which is right, which is wrong, dunno!

If you really want to ensure that you don't hold shares in companies that don't transcend your own personal envelope of ethics, then buy individual equities, and be prepared to keep monitoring them to see if their policies (or your ethics!) change so you can sell as and when it's necessary.

My wife refuses to directly hold shares in tobacco companies, which I 50% understand, but also 50% completely fail to comprehend when I look at their growth and yield.

atush

I am a big anti smoker, and do not hold Tobacco myself. But, it is legal and someone is making money from it. I was certainly very happy when the laws came in that banned smoking in public places and I am completely behind a ban on smoking in cars (I was subjected to hours long/days long car rides with 2 smoking parents of a child- and yes I ahd asthma).

But if my funds or trusts hold them, I am not bothered. It isn't like I would not hold companies that produce booze/wine/beer (which i do partake of). And i certainly don't drink drive or force others to drink.

margaretclare

atush wrote: »

I am a big anti smoker, and do not hold Tobacco myself. But, it is legal and someone is making money from it. I was certainly very happy when the laws came in that banned smoking in public places and I am completely behind a ban on smoking in cars (I was subjected to hours long/days long car rides with 2 smoking parents of a child- and yes I had asthma).

But if my funds or trusts hold them, I am not bothered. It isn't like I would not hold companies that produce booze/wine/beer (which i do partake of). And i certainly don't drink drive or force others to drink.

For me it is not so much individual 'ethics' about tobacco, it is many years of seeing the effects in someone close to me and also in my professional career. I have seen more ill-health, disability and premature death from this product than you can shake a stick at. I don't feel the same about wine or beer, although I might do if - say - someone close to me had died of alcoholic poisoning. I like traditional English pubs, I like 'real beer' and I enjoy having a meal in a pub not having other people's smoke forced on me while I eat. We had a nice pub meal a few days ago and I had half a pint of the local beer. Not exactly what you'd call 'boozing'! However, there have been times in years past when I came home from an evening out and had to take off all my clothes to be washed, shower and wash my hair, because of the all-pervading stink of smoke.

Going to other countries where alcohol is forbidden, 'usury' i.e. interest on savings and investments, also forbidden, it's not so much 'ethics' as the official religion of that country. Although, when I worked in Saudi Arabia in the late 1980s, one of the first things I was told was how to make wine from fruit juice and sugar available in the supermarket! I said 'No thank you, I don't think I'll bother' and some of my Arab colleagues wondered 'how you cope' with doing without your wine in our country? I said I rarely drink wine and it doesn't bother me.

My wife refuses to directly hold shares in tobacco companies, which I 50% understand, but also 50% completely fail to comprehend when I look at their growth and yield.

The fund I've just switched out of, which jamesd mentioned above, has been doing better than any of my other funds! And yes, I know tobacco investing is legal, but that's not the point. I don't care how well it's doing but I still don't want to invest in it.