BTL Investors hit Bonanza

CRASH_BANG_WALLOP

MrRee wrote: »

Rents UP

House Prices UP

Confidence UP

I haven't felt so confident in gathering even more riches than I do in 2012 .....

and your mrs tells me you can never get it up

the_flying_pig

Conrad wrote: »

As ever, a purely academic approach to matters leaves one blinded to reality.

The reality is that huge numbers of let properties are officially resi mortgages, often where people have moved on and let thier previous home.

Also I've know many people purchase a house 'intending' to reside, but then having changed thier minds and let it out.

i don't really buy that. BTL mortgages account for a considerably smaller proportion of all mortgages than it did at peak but that other types of BTL [i.e. BTL without BTL mortgages] are nonetheless SOARing.

in your opinion is it at all possible to use published facts [as opposed to idle ramping & generalities] to find out whether BTL is getting bigger or not?

wotsthat

the_flying_pig wrote: »

in your opinion is it at all possible to use published facts [as opposed to idle ramping & generalities] to find out whether BTL is getting bigger or not?

Some interesting stuff here....

http://www.communities.gov.uk/publications/corporate/statistics/ehs200910householdreport

Some 67 per cent of the 21.6 million households in England in 2009-10 were owner-occupiers, 17 per cent were social renters, and 16 per cent were private renters. Owner-occupation declined from 14.8 million (71 per cent) in 2005 to 14.5 million (67 per cent ) in 2009-10.

I can't see a reason why the trend of reduced owner occupation didn't continue in 2011 or won't continue in 2012.

the_flying_pig

wotsthat wrote: »

Some interesting stuff here....

http://www.communities.gov.uk/publications/corporate/statistics/ehs200910householdreport



I can't see a reason why the trend of reduced owner occupation didn't continue in 2011 or won't continue in 2012.

Very plausible but the only point I'm making is that, contrary to one of Hamish's favourite mantras, the rise of BTL started well before 'mortgage rationing'.

The CML chart I posted actually shows that the first couple of post 'credit crunch' actually sent BTL into retreat a little.

geneer

Rinoa wrote: »

Why did you decide the bulls were correct and totally capitulate in 2009?

Buying after a crash = total capitulation.
You might have to show your working on that one.

How many BTLs do you own then Columbo? :rotfl:

Rinoa

geneer wrote: »

Buying after a crash = total capitulation.
You might have to show your working on that one.

Oh, the crash was over alright. But you didn't think so at the time. Indeed, you predicted an 8% fall for 2010. Your hero Jonathan Davies even predicted a 10% fall.

The bulls were predicting the crash was over and you evidently concluded we were correct. I guess you just didn't want to admit it at the time.

Percy1983

Conrad wrote: »

Most that I see are enjoying signifiant monthly rental profit as thier mortgage variable rate is so incredibly low. Bare in mind many are still resi mortgages on ultra low tracking rates such as base MINUS 0.2 fore example. Some clients are paying about 0.1%.

So often people say things to me like, the B2L pays thier car and holiday costs.

Well as I keep saying you can't stop greed.

Anyway back to it, you have to admit that many expanded the empire by borrowing against the current empire, with increasing prices (therefore increasing equity) and lax lending helping.

Yes rich people are still buying them outright FTB and BTL nothing changed there.

Yes BTL is always going to be around, but its not just for any chancer any more (as is buying homes generally).

geneer

Rinoa wrote: »

Oh, the crash was over alright. But you didn't think so at the time. Indeed, you predicted an 8% fall for 2010. Your hero Jonathan Davies even predicted a 10% fall.

The bulls were predicting the crash was over and you evidently concluded we were correct. I guess you just didn't want to admit it at the time.

Ah. I see. So what your saying is the bulls predicted when the crash they utterly failed to see coming would end . Right you are then.

SO...how many BTLs do you own then?

Rinoa

geneer wrote: »

So what your saying is the bulls predicted when the crash they utterly failed to see coming would end . Right you are then.

I'm saying you surrendered any credibility you ever had when you totally capitulated and bought.

You just didn't have the bottle to fess up at the time. Of course, you had to eventually as your 'implied' position of continuing to rent was becoming an untenable losing strategy. Naturally, you made it appear as though you had kept it secret to outwit the bulls, but no one actually believed that.

geneer wrote: »

SO...how many BTLs do you own then?

Same number as I've always owned. None.

CRASH_BANG_WALLOP

Rinoa wrote: »

Same number as I've always owned. None.

None???!!! zero???! Nada!!!???? you give the impression you are Mr Wilson