Mary Portas - Car Boot Sales

Mallotum_X

StevieJ wrote: »

Handforth? I used to work in Wilmslow and Handforth was never top of the shopping pops, have they built something new there?

Handforth Dean was around about 13 years ago, maybe 15. Not sure whats there now, but was a large M+S and various other bits built with the upgrading of the A34 and the link road back to Bramhall.

wymondham

speaking locally - when the town council introduced charging to park, and every other shop is a pizza shop or charity shop theres not really any incentive.... and to top it all the christmas lights are pathetic .... ho ho ho merry christmas everyone (especially Amazon!)

thescouselander

Kennyboy66 wrote: »

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/retailandconsumer/8952950/Mary-Portas-shopping-is-gone-bring-back-the-car-boot-sale.html


Put car boot sales on the high street ????

I can't think or a worse idea.

Liverpools main shopping street (before Liverpool 1 was built), used to have a load of market stalls selling absolute tat & fakes.

They were situated right outside M & S and John Lewis, and the council spent years and no end of money in high court costs trying to get rid of them. I reckon many people went to the Trafford Centre or Chester just to avoid what was a miserable shopping experience.

Do we really want car boot sales on the high street with people selling knock off footie shirts, dvd, perfume etc, etc ?

What do the MSE retail experts think ?

Yeah, I remember that - it had to be seen to be believed. Terrible idea.

fc123

Errata wrote: »

Mary Portas giving advice? She'll be singing a different tune when her shop in House of Fraser has the biggest January sale imaginable and then closes down.

I have been desp to find a snippet of time to comment on her 'review' and the other thread ' failing retailers'. Some good comments under the article in the Telegraph too;
Telegraph comments here

It's quite hard to fail as a retailer if your range is promoted as a 'reality show' on prime time telly and you have a large section in a store with the biggest footfall and spend per linear foot of selling space in the country. Mind you, I went to 'see' and couldn't spot any of the 'telly staff' but it was the busiest section of the entire floor plus 'young fashion' on second was even quieter.
I have just 'done' 30 months on that road (and had experience of 2 locations same st) so when I say footfall and spend are way up there, trust me it's true. Sales volumes are insane on that road. You just cannot compare. I can compare to 2 other locations in UK that I have had stores in and they were prime busy areas too.

I can't quite work out why she was picked to do the study as she isn't really a 'retialer' as such, more a marketing person but she is quite familiar and high profile so guess that's the reason.

Her conclusions are well meant and she seems to want to combine the earthiness of farmers markets (of which I am a big fan as I am a London surburbanite in touch with my worthy side and our local one is a godsend saving hard earnt spend going into nasty Asda coffers) and accessability to independent retailers to be able to trade in 'prime retail locations'. The ideal is a nice soundbite but the reality is times have changed and so have peoples shopping habits.

I hate to bring this up but my dear old dad retired as a councillor last year + just got 'freedom of the borough' and some of this was due to him and our local MP's determination to ' save' our local High St. The main thing they did was get free half hour parking bays up and down both sides. I believe it is still the only London suburb to have free 'pop in' parking. Parking isn't the only issue but it is still the main one.

Councils see cars as cash cows end of.

He still chats to all the local shopkeepers and the newsagent, who has been there decades, got the opportunity to measure his walk to town trade and drive by recently.
Due to road works all the bays outside and near him were closed for several weeks. He had an immediate drop in T/O of 40%. If the free 'pop in' bays were removed (council are now considering changing to meters but this allows people to clog up the space for 2- 4 hours) he knows the effect on his business. He cannot sustain a drop in T/O of 40% (that can't be re-couped elswhere) so would have to close.

I could go on for pages about this (but won't zzzzz you all) but will stick to one tale as we just had a lucky 6k escape.

A couple of months back we were cold called to take a 'stall' at a major shopping centre nearby (2nd biggest in UK I think) @ 6k for 4 days. Now this is an expensive stall but we were unable to view the space as it hadn't been opened yet. It was 16 sq m and the added costs to us would have been van hire to transport my luxe, custom shopfit (:o) staff over the 4 days, lost productivity of OH over 6 days (including day before set up and breakdown) plus other sundry costs.
Our target T/O would have been 25k and the event should have cleared us about 25% after VAT, costs etc. (higher cos I have manufacturer margin as we manufacture our own product) but we heard Bad Things about the venue the week before from a friend who did a stand there the previous week at a very reputable event. Most traders threatened to walk out after day 1 due to the low footfall (which is due to where it is located within the centre).

We then popped down to see it last week as a food fair was on and agreed that it won't work due to the location in relation to the main centre walkway, especially if they want to charge 2k for even the tiniest stall which is Olympia/NEC rates. However, most stall holders said they would be happy to pay £50 per day for the event rather than the £500 that they were charged. Many complained about the demographic being not right for the event and the lack of footfall.

This is the crux as this venue will have to drop it's rates (but won't be able to as they are part of 'the plan') but is just the type of thing MP would have liked. We loved the idea when first told about it but it is an add on to the main centre and way too expensive for niche indie tradrers.

Won't go into details but we met an organiser at another event last week who confirmed our fears and, as word goes about, it was acknowledged that there was no way we would meet target and were missold the event (there was no 'fashion section' as were promised for example) so we were offered to cancel, which we did.

These so called 'market' areas. Someone has to run them, collect the rents, 'police' the traders (in a nice way but there have to quite a lot of rules.....we did markets 25 yrs back in central London), sort the rubbish, monitor parking to unload/ pack up and this isn't free but most traders won't pay more than £50 per day per stall but would expect to T/O about £800 - £1200 min per pitch. MP has obviously never done a stall in her life plus she frequents Spitalfields/Brick Lane markets which are in a whole league of their own, not least, they have a large tourist spend and some of the sites up there are run by a very philanthropic landowner who doesn't run them for the cash....except he's quiet about it so no-one knows the true sums.

I think I am droning now but so much gossip, so little time

I like MP but she inhabits and judges things by telly London La La -land not Real out of London-Land.


Anyone interested in more tales as I have a lot of stockists who are indies in all sorts of places in UK (and rest of world and turns out, they all have similar issues..... except Bahrain who had really serious probs as an indie retauiler last year due to the uprisings) and we end up chatting about trade and stuff so I have loads of anecdotal on diff obscure towns and how some are doing really well (and why) and others aren't?:)

Kennyboy66

fc123 wrote: »

I think I am droning now but so much gossip, so little time

I like MP but she inhabits and judges things by telly London La La -land not Real out of London-Land.


Anyone interested in more tales as I have a lot of stockists who are indies in all sorts of places in UK (and rest of world and turns out, they all have similar issues..... except Bahrain who had really serious probs as an indie retauiler last year due to the uprisings) and we end up chatting about trade and stuff so I have loads of anecdotal on diff obscure towns and how some are doing really well (and why) and others aren't?:)

Always love to read your posts fc123.

nearlyrich

I have done all my Christmas shopping on line this year as I have been ill for the last four weeks and the thought of wandering about in the cold carrying heavy bags has not been the top of my list of things to do. The problem with the high street is you have to pay to park, there are loads of other people getting in the way and shopping from the comfort of my settee at 10pm is much less stressful. I hate car boot sales and markets are either fantastic or full of tat. The high street is going the way of corner shops in the face of supermarkets if only I could predict what comes next after the internet I could make a fortune.

fc123

Kennyboy66 wrote: »

Always love to read your posts fc123.

Why thank you KB66 :kisses3: I should be doing something else (ironically on topic as a stockist in NYC wants me to call her to discuss her order to arrive just before Xmas and I need to do it tonight when it's day time over there) and I wanted to watch the 40k pa salary programme but have missed a chunk so will have to wait for it to go on catch up. Any one see it? Is there a thread?

Our local High St has changed massively since I was a kid but I have noticed, since we moved back that there are a lot more independents on it than 10 years ago (as the stores were unlettable to chains as they all went to the mega mall nearby) and they include things that aren't 'done' online.

We now have a 'Nails' shop which is always packed and no space on Saturdays unless you book 3 weeks ahead.

The old hairdressers are still there but have converted their upstairs into waxing/tanning/ facepack/ de-wrinkle salons

Seperate beauty salons and tanning place.

I think in the 70's women must have been paler and hairier as nothing like this used to exist.

Probably 4 times as many eating out places from Polski cafes to affordable, amazing quality Turkish place, posh Italian and so on. Nothing lke that in my childhood.

My granddads fave pub (trad place) has been derelict for some years and has re-opened as a Thai place

2 huge poundlands/ 99p stores where the Co-op Dept store and Woolworths used to be both always busy. I don't think you can buy pound shop stuff online anywhere? I could be wrong but the PO costs don't work unless you buy 20 things and not heavy stuff.

Graham_Devon

The biggest problem Mary Portas has is really simple.

Excessive charges.

Whether that be car parking charges, or council retail charges. She needs to create something without reducing those charges.

We have, with intent, made it far more viable to build out of town shopping centres. The idea was that this would reduce congestion etc. And that has worked, in some ways. It's just made congestion on trunk routes instead, with badly planned entrances and exits from ever expanding retail parks, meaning 1 set of traffice lights, then another 100 yards away, and a bit of a nightmare. Often ok when they started, but how many people have noticed Barrats rabbit hutches popping up all around them, utilising the road network intended for the out of town shopping centres?

The problem now, is that's very hard to reverse. If you cut business rates or car parking charges, the council loses money and that has to be gained from elsewhere.

If they really want to revive the high street, then there are only a couple of things they have to do. Reduce, or make car parking free. Reduce business rates. And make it easier for us, the shoppers. Out of town centres are often well planned out. In town highstreets can often be very difficult.

For instance, in one of the bigger towns I use, theres an Argos. Great. But you can't park anywhere near it. Which means you can't pick up any large goods. You used to be able to, but they extended the pavements by utlising all the car parking down one side of the road. It's far easier to go another 8 miles to the out of town argos, which has space, parking and proper loading bays, with proper large trolleys to help you get the item from Argos to your car.

While shopping in the high street can sometimes be nice, if you are just milling around, REAL shopping can often be just pointlessly stressful. And don't even get me started on all the stupid boards everywhere outside shops taking up pavements, along with a costa coffee which believes it owns the entire pedestrianised walking area and has filled it with metal tables, chairs and stupid brollies. With a buggy it's just more stress.

Graham_Devon

Out,_Vile_Jelly wrote: »

Farmers markets with local fruit and veg are surely a win-win in terms of helping small producers and the nation's waistlines. Supermarket veg is over-packaged and over-priced.

Are Farmers markets actually lower cost?

Never been to one. Not sure if there is one anywhere near to me, which is bizzare, considering the amount of farms.

All we have is a multitude of farm shops. They are OK, but don't really sell that much stuff. Half of the she;ves are filled things such as Olive oil bottled with multicoloured pasta, for £8.99.

While, to be fair, the meat is better quality, so it should be, for the price.

Maybe I'm not exploring enough. But most farm shops I have been too, seem to be excuses for selling Dandelion and Elderflower cordial at £3.95 for a 500ml bottle.

Even eggs, I remember not too long back, were £3.15 a dozen. Free range see....so free range you can actually see them running around, which again, is nice, but bloody expensive.

fc123

Graham_Devon wrote: »

The biggest problem Mary Portas has is really simple.

Excessive charges.

Whether that be car parking charges, or council retail charges. She needs to create something without reducing those charges.

---

.

While shopping in the high street can sometimes be nice, if you are just milling around, REAL shopping can often be just pointlessly stressful. And don't even get me started on all the stupid boards everywhere outside shops taking up pavements, along with a costa coffee which believes it owns the entire pedestrianised walking area and has filled it with metal tables, chairs and stupid brollies. With a buggy it's just more stress.

It is chicken and egg too as the councils and Landlords just didn't see it coming. The mega mall owners and out of town parks (with free, easy and plentiful parking) took away the bulk, quality spend leaving the grains behind on the small trad High St.

They honestly thought that the High Sts wouldn't be affected.
Woolwich town centre in London is classic as it was chipped away at from the early 80's and was almost derelict a few years back as the final nail was to pedestrianise it a deacde back and surround it with parking meters. The other problem was a couple of big old fashioned insurance co + pension fund owned most of the once prime property and refused to lower the rents. It actually too 20 years to fade away.

I walked up a once busy side street into the main area and a gigantic building (I know who owns it as they are our current LL) is standing empty, left to rot and there are actually trees growing out of the upper floor windows.

The other side is it is now full off temporary lets (all independents) reacting to what the local commnunity wants... from food to clothes and barbers. It's now very busy and, I think, has a lot of atomosphere but some would say it is shabby and 'downmarket'.