OBR: Immigration Vital for Growth

Graham_Devon

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

So I just don't see why people succumb to the ignorant anti-immigrant rhetoric peddled by the bigots. (And lets be clear, they are bigots, no matter how they like to dress it up)

In other words, "listen to me and what I say, agree with me, regardless of what I am saying - if you don't, I can, and I will, call you a bigot".

So there really is no option to disagree with you or debate this subject....is there?

Malcolm.

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

Once again you fall victim to the fallacy of static systems.

There is no displacement.

A population of 100 million needs pretty much twice as many doctors, lawyers, judges, nurses, street sweepers, fast food employees, taxi drivers, etc as a population of 50 million. And barring unavoidable fluctuations due to the economic boom/bust cycle, long term unemployment in the UK has remained more or less constant in percentage terms for many decades now, despite the increase in population and immigrants. Because over the long term, an increase in population creates a corresponding increase in the number of jobs.

There will always be a percentage of people unemployed, but this is inevitable. Some people are just unemployable. Besides, full employment is not remotely desirable, as amongst other things it's highly inflationary.

Earlier posts in this thread have pointed out that migrants are an economic net benefit to the UK, and that they actually have a positive impact on wages.

So I just don't see why people succumb to the ignorant anti-immigrant rhetoric peddled by the bigots. (And lets be clear, they are bigots, no matter how they like to dress it up)

A higher population means less natural resource per citizen. There's a reason the british aren't as wealthy from north sea oil as the Norwegians. Why we have busier roads and smaller new builds.

HAMISH_MCTAVISH

wotsthat wrote: »

I don't think you necessarily have to be a bigot or xenophobe to question whether immigration is vital to health of the nation.

When the evidence is so crystal clear that it is vital, then there are no credible alternative explanations for why the anti-immigration zealots behave the way they do.

Malcolm.

I'm all for tier 2 visas for shortage occupations, but let's be clear. Some immigrants add to the economy and some don't. It's not as simple as all immigration is good, or all immigration is bad.

HAMISH_MCTAVISH

Malcolm. wrote: »

Why we have busier roads and smaller new builds.

That's more down to the eco-mentalists forcing their agenda on planning and road building for the last few decades.

Less than 4% of the UK is built on. Plenty of room for more.

HAMISH_MCTAVISH

Malcolm. wrote: »

A higher population means less natural resource per citizen. .

A higher population means less national debt per citizen too....;)

Malcolm.

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

That's more down to the eco-mentalists forcing their agenda on planning and road building for the last few decades.

Less than 4% of the UK is built on. Plenty of room for more.

You need a large amount of land to feed the population. With crop harvests failing more and more regularly, the gtee of food supply is essential. Russia stopped exporting wheat. It's in the national interest to be able to be self reliant if need be.

Malcolm.

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

A higher population means less national debt per citizen too....;)

Norway has a lower population and less debt than us.

Having more people living beyond there means doesn't neccesarily help matters, it only helps the short term stats.

wotsthat

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

When the evidence is so crystal clear that it is vital, then there are no credible alternative explanations for why the anti-immigration zealots behave the way they do.

It might be vital but that's because successive governments have failed to utilise the potential UK workforce so now we have to import labour.

It seems like common sense to question why we should encourage immigration whilst, in many many cases, the native population are subsidised to not work.

I can't see the racism in anything I've said.

HAMISH_MCTAVISH

Malcolm. wrote: »

You need a large amount of land to feed the population.

Around 70% of UK land is used for agriculture, the rest is not suitable for such use, and we have not been self reliant for many decades.

That leaves 26% we could build on by the way.

Besides, agriculture accounts for just 1.8% of UK GDP, it's simply not economically viable to continue reserving so much of it for inefficient uses.