Is it time to end the 50% tax rate? Poll discussion

g0recki

I agree with steve goodman that we all pay too much income tax. But I don't think that necessarily means supporting scrapping the 50% rate, because only the highest earners pay it. If we all pay too much tax, then raising the personal allowance is the way to give everyone a tax cut, not just those making mega-bucks.

Thinking about income tax, I just don't think it's fair at all. I think most of us think social mobility is a good principle - everyone should be able to succeed in life from whatever background. But the only way people from poor backgrounds can financially succeed in life is by earning income. So taking a percentage of people's hard-earned income away from them is anti-social mobility.

What's confusing is that it's normally left-wing folk who get most worked up about poverty, disadvantage and so on. But then the left are the ones who are for increasing the tax on our incomes. I think this is one of the biggest failings of logic of the left.

beanybot

I think its mental people who earn 150k+ should give half their money to the government. Don't get me wrong, I only earn 16k but I have ambition and hopefully one day want to earn a lot of money but this tax system doesn't exactly encourage you to strive to better yourself or your income. Of course higher earners should pay more tax but not 50%, that's mental and just penalizes people for being successful.

JimmyTheWig

Anti 50p rate say: It disincentivises growth/success and encourages wealthy to take cash away from UK

I have a real bee in my bonnet about this at the moment.

Those on tax credits (i.e. most people with children) lose 73% of any extra income they earn through tax, NI and reduced tax credits.
And if that increase pushes you into paying higher rate tax it's even worse as you're looking at losing child benefit next year.

Many on benefits are worse off financially if they work.

Yet we're all expected to work as hard as we can while those top earners are expected to take their cash away from the UK if they have to lose 50% of any extra they earn.
It's all just a con to try to persuede us to let the richest people keep more of their money.

wozearly

deano98 wrote: »

It doesn't work like that, you only pay 40% on anything you earn over £35K (up to £150K), once you go over £150K you pay 50% on anything over £150K

Actually, that's not quite right. The thresholds stack on top of each other, so you don't start paying 40% tax until you've earned £7,475 of tax-free income plus £35,000 of 20% taxed income (ie, your annual income is over £42,475).

The 50% band hits people with annual incomes of over £192,475.

wozearly

JimmyTheWig wrote: »

I have a real bee in my bonnet about this at the moment.

Those on tax credits (i.e. most people with children) lose 73% of any extra income they earn through tax, NI and reduced tax credits.
And if that increase pushes you into paying higher rate tax it's even worse as you're looking at losing child benefit next year.

Many on benefits are worse off financially if they work.

Yet we're all expected to work as hard as we can while those top earners are expected to take their cash away from the UK if they have to lose 50% of any extra they earn.
It's all just a con to try to persuede us to let the richest people keep more of their money.

The same problem applies wherever the marginal tax rate is high, and is a strong argument for looking at whether the systems are working as intended (ie, raising more revenue) or encouraging evasive behaviour and unintended consequences.

Edit: Just to clarify, I agree completely with your point. The same logic for revisiting and reviewing whether the 50% tax rate is 'right' should be applied to whether working tax credits are working in the 'right' way.

libertino

If the economists say it should be cut, I trust their expertise. However, whatever level it is set to is what the taxman should fully recoup from the taxpayers. The rich choose to spend much of their time living and working in the UK because they find it a great place to live. If they want it to stay that way and they want to continue benefitting from that, they must contribute. It's morally terrible that they would want to find workarounds to pay as little tax as legally possible, paying accounting experts to save paying more to the taxman. If they want to do their banking in tax havens, see if they find them havens to live in too.

pinkpanther22

The higher tax rates are a considerable dis-incentive. There is also a point where if you are self-employed via a limited company in order to keep your tax and NICS affairs in order you actually end up paying tax at closer to 62% by the time you have taken into account corporation tax as well as your own and your employee's income tax requirements. (I should add I'm not in this situation, but my partner is). Exactly what incentive is there to grow a business and employ people if that's going to happen?

Why is anyone surprised that people try and dodge the system when it is patently unfair. Moreover, why should people who work hard have to fund the lifestyles of a social underclass (in the form of benefits) that the Labour government facilitated. The argument is not simply about paying the tax, it's also about where it's being wasted.

worldwheeler

vbrindle wrote: »

I had to mention this. This little thing called inflation.

Eventually we are all going to need pay rises as the cost of things are always going up. This is what inflation does. It makes things cost more and means everyone will need to be paid more.

I would say who is going to get this fictitious pay rise?? I don't think you understand inflation and what it does or who controls "the business cycle" Capital is king and labour is slavery. The capital interests will use their bought and paid for Muppet press prostitutes to push a guilt trip on to the people that its all their fault the country is in debt!! Austerity, yes you people who went out and duped bank managers into lending you £300,000, when you work in a shop earning £19k, it is your fault and therefore all shop, factory and manual labour have to be chastised and have no services for even greater tax payments. The greater tax is used to pay the poor stupid banker who was SO fooled by the brilliant shelf stacker into lending all that paper. It's a system of wealth transfer that is run and controlled by the few people that benefit from it to the detriment of the many. "Never in the field of finance has so much been stolen from so many by so few for their own benefit"


Its all a dream. Persuade the public that one day they will be rich, a member of the elite, and they will demand protection for their masters even though these lords will tweak the controls of THEIR financial system and money supply which will ensure the people remain indentured slaves to the lords ever increasing benefit. "It's called the American dream because you can only believe it if you are asleep"

Saetana

The whole idea of PAYE (pay as you earn) is that a person pays an amount of tax on every pound they earn above their personal tax allowance. As top tax bracket payers are paying tax on a LOT more pounds than basic rate payers on average then I see no reason why they should get stung with a 50% tax level, add on national insurance and these people can be paying more than half their wages in tax beyond a certain point, which is totally ridiculous! I do think the Conservatives will get rid of the 50% tax bracket when they can but, the way things are going at the moment, this could be a long time, unless of course it proves that the 50% tax code is not working which would not surprise me one little bit.

By the way, I am not nor ever have been a top rate taxpayer, my position is one of fairness, why should those who have either taken time and spent money to get an education or have worked themselves to the top of their career, or built up a business, have to pay a larger percentage per pound than those with less drive and who contribute less to the economy as a whole? Too many people on here lump all rich people together, more of them have made their money than have inherited it and it is these people we need to keep in this country.

tommygirl3

I think we should have one tax rate of say 30%. That way poor and rich alike pay the same proportion of their income as tax. Encourages people to better themselves and stop ppl misunderstanding the graduated tax system.