URGENT help needed-deed of variation

sunshine25

I'll try to cut a long story short

Great aunt dies 2 weeks ago leaving a 6th of her estate to my father. As far as I can gather from the executors the will states 'to my father, or if he has deceased to his spouse'

My father has been told yesterday he has 2-4 weeks left due to cancer. His will states all money to go to his wife

Wife has financial issues and creditors are now chasing and house has been repossessed. Any funds paid to her will immediately be taken away
(it's like east Enders isn't it!)

Questions:
Can father make deed of variation on my aunts will, to change money's to come to his 2 children? Who needs to agree this? Just him, him & wife, or the other 2 executors? All 6 immediate benificaries?
What other means can we use to change aunts will?
How long does this take? How can we process this in a week?

Horrendous situation

Also as aunt died to weeks ago and father is still alive, which dates is the effective date? If he dies in 2 weeks does aunts will stand as ' money to father' or as he may have passed does this mean that wife gets it directly-is there a will hierarchy?

Immediate advise desperately needed as clock is ticking

Many thanks in advance

antrobus

First things first. Sorry to hear about your father.

sunshine25 wrote: »

Can father make deed of variation on my aunts will, to change money's to come to his 2 children?

Yes

sunshine25 wrote: »

Who needs to agree this? Just him, him & wife, or the other 2 executors? All 6 immediate benificaries?

Just your father.

Although on other threads on the subject there has been some debate about whether you can only have one deed of variation per will or not. So it might be a question of contacting the other 5 beneficiaries to check whether or not they have any similar plans.

sunshine25 wrote: »

Also as aunt died to weeks ago and father is still alive, which dates is the effective date?

The effective date will be the date your aunt died.

sunshine25 wrote: »

If he dies in 2 weeks does aunts will stand as ' money to father' or as he may have passed does this mean that wife gets it directly-is there a will hierarchy?

If your aunt's will specifies that the bequest goes to your father "or if he has deceased to his spouse", then since your father was still alive at the time of your aunt's death, he gets the money, and it will form part of his estate when he dies and be distributed in accordance with his will.

If your father's will states everything will go to his wife, wouldn't it be easier for him to change his will so that everything went to his 2 children?

Granted that might not be tax efficient in terms of IHT but then perhaps with the sums involved it might not matter.

The wife might have grounds to challenge the new will, but why should she if everything would go to her creditors anyway? I suppose her creditors would have a reason to challenge the will, but I have no idea as to whether they can do so at law.

Best advice I can give is go see a solicitor today.

tyllwyd

I agree that the simplest solution looks to be for your father to change his will - there isn't any time constraint on that, he could scribble something on a piece of paper, have it signed and witnessed and that would be that. But it would be much better to have proper advice from a solictor, and that might take a bit of time (although they might be willing to do it quicker if you up the fee?) But are you sure it is in your mum's best interests for the money to by-pass her - if she has money troubles, perhaps with the inheritance she could use the money to make full and final offers to her creditors to settle her debts, and then have piece of mind at least.

sunshine25

Thank you all for your answers and support

For the DOV, how can we get this arranged? My father is in hospital so cannot visit the solicitor. Can one of the executors get the DOV from the solicitor and bring it to him for signing or cam I get a firm of the Internet and take it to him to be witnessed?

All very distressing!

tyllwyd

You might be able to find a solicitor who is willing to visit your father in hospital. If a solicitor is going to act they will probably need to see him in person to make sure that this is actually what he wants (ie that he isn't under pressure from his children to sign away the inheritance) and that he is mentally capable of making the decision.

thenudeone

A solicitor should be able to visit and get a will drawn up very quickly - no more than a day or two in the circumstances.
My great aunt died whilst waiting several weeks for a solicitor to type up a will which was significantly different to where her assets would go if she died intestate; and her assets went to close relatives who barely saw her from one decade to the next, rather than her niece (my mother) who visited and stayed regularly.
For the sake of a few hundred pounds of solicitors fees, it's worth ensuring a) that your father's best interests are secured and b) that his wishes for his family (wife and children)'s best interests; will be implemented, by signing a new will.

John_Pierpoint

Do I get the feeling that father and mother are in some way "estranged"?
Does mother intend to declare herself bankrupt?
I've had a similar situation with a dying relative (it included an amusing exchange between the solicitor and the "doctor" on duty in the hospital; because the solicitor wanted a counter signature to say the soon-to-be-deceased was still of sound mind,)
The costs were in the region of £1,500 as everyone rallied round to meet the deadline of "possibly any time now".

To really comment further all of us on the forum need to do a bit more of a fact find.

This thread gives some pointers to the rights of "bankrupt" wife (or her trustee in bankruptcy)
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/46303643#Comment_46303643

So there might be a case for an IoV and a new will.

antrobus

thenudeone wrote: »

A solicitor should be able to visit and get a will drawn up very quickly - no more than a day or two in the circumstances....

Yes indeed. It's fairly common for solicitors to be obliged to attend hospitals and the like to deal with such matters.

John_Pierpoint wrote: »

Do I get the feeling that father and mother are in some way "estranged"?

Well my assumption was (if the OP will pardon the intrusion) was that the references to the 'father' and his 'wife' meant that the latter wasn't the mother, but rather a second wife. There may well be issues regarding the 'family dynamics' here that we do not know about, but that is the sort of thing that is likely best dealt with by a real live professional, which is what the OP needs at this point in time.

John_Pierpoint

Hence my link to Inheritance (Provision for Family & Dependants) Act 1975

That act does not distinguish between siblings and step siblings,
nor parents and step parents unless a very clean break divorce/re-marriage is involved.

There is no "compassion" expressed about the predicament of the near bankrupt(?) spouse.

Hence my sensation that we have not been told the full story and cannot offer realistic advice.

sunshine25

Thanks all. Yes correct 'wife' is not mother but that's irrelavant. She is s spouse (no offense taken) and sort of estranged (another long story!)

Wife knows that any funds will be taken by creditors and both wife and father agree funds should come to children.

Original concern was the need to assertain if aunts will stands ie funds got to father, then to spouse, and if by time will is read & estate disbursed it is doubtful that my father will still be here. Unfortunately father is very poorly but still has all his marbles (apart from Marrying wife ;0)) so is totally capable of completing DOV

Thanks for everyone's advice and comments

Savvy_Sue

I realise it may be a bit late, but

antrobus wrote: »

Just your father.

Although on other threads on the subject there has been some debate about whether you can only have one deed of variation per will or not. So it might be a question of contacting the other 5 beneficiaries to check whether or not they have any similar plans.

my understanding was that ALL beneficiaries had to agree a DofV, rather than just the person affected.

Quicker and simpler would be for the father to amend his will.