Found out I was self-employed after 2 months they want expenses back

avril0812

I left my full time employment after losing my business to join one of my suppliers after they told me I could make more money. It wasnt until yesterday 2months into the job that I found out I was self employed. As far as I am aware if your employer tells you the hours to work and when to be in the office you are not self employed. They guaranteed me a set amount per month and then would pay commission on top if I met certain sales targets -- again not visibly self employed. I hadnt received a payslip yet and asked for one and was told then.
They had given me a cheque at the end of last month for expenses as I wasnt being reimbursed for my car use, business miles or parking expenses and now received a text that they want it back. I cannot be self employed as they are not paying me enough to save up the extra tax and NI so couldnt continue working for them. Have they got any right to ask for the expenses back given it was for the previous month?:(

DCFC79

Did you ask questions like pay, is it se or employed work before you accepted the job

avril0812

We agreed to a salary and commission on top for sales made over a certain limit. We also discussed after a 3 month period (probationary) I would get a company or hire car and a company phone and being in employment over 13 years there was nothing standing out to me saying I was self employed at all.

mariefab

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/employment-status/index.htm#1

LittleVoice

avril0812 wrote: »

I left my full time employment after losing my business to join one of my suppliers after they told me I could make more money. It wasnt until yesterday 2months into the job that I found out I was self employed. As far as I am aware if your employer tells you the hours to work and when to be in the office you are not self employed. They guaranteed me a set amount per month and then would pay commission on top if I met certain sales targets -- again not visibly self employed. I hadnt received a payslip yet and asked for one and was told then.
They had given me a cheque at the end of last month for expenses as I wasnt being reimbursed for my car use, business miles or parking expenses and now received a text that they want it back. I cannot be self employed as they are not paying me enough to save up the extra tax and NI so couldnt continue working for them. Have they got any right to ask for the expenses back given it was for the previous month?:(

If you were self-employed you would be invoicing them and they would be paying you against invoice. If they pay expenses that could be either because you were an employee or because you were self-employed charging them the expenses.

What paperwork did you provide for them to have paid you the expenses they are now trying to re-claim?

Mistral001

Was an actual salary figure, for example, £##,### per year, mentioned when you where offered the job?

Hammyman

avril0812 wrote: »

I cannot be self employed as they are not paying me enough to save up the extra tax and NI

Where do you get the idea you pay extra tax and NI? Unless you set up as a Ltd Company, you don't pay any more NI than you do as an employee so I fail to see why you think you should be getting paid more.

It is up to you to put aside the money for tax and NI out of what you've been paid - its called self discipline.

KiKi

You need to firstly establish whether the job itself is employed or self-employed, using the HMRC link above.

Then you need to establish what you agreed to. Did you agree an actual salary, or just a rate?

Lastly, if you have been self-employed, then you won't have received any salary at all, yet, as you need to invoice to be paid. So the big question is: have you been paid at all for your work? If so, they that shows they believed you are employed.

(You suggest you have been paid, based on your comment that Hammyman quoted. But you need to clarify whether this was a salary, or paying an invoice. If you invoiced and they paid you, then you have to put tax and NI aside out of that, I'm afraid.)

KiKi

InsideInsurance

Hammyman wrote: »

Where do you get the idea you pay extra tax and NI?

The difference would be that if your an employee what you employer gives you is the net figure where as if you are self employed your client gives you the gross amount.

Were you given a contract of any form? If so, what does the contract state? From the wording it should be fairly clear what the relationship is.

KiKi wrote:

You need to firstly establish whether the job itself is employed or self-employed, using the HMRC link above.

The link doesnt really help 100%. It is possible to be a self employed contractor - though most companies wont take the risk and so insist that their contractors go through either an umbrella or set themselves up as a Ltd company. If it is the later then there are issues or IR35 for the contractor still. http://www.ir35calc.co.uk/contractor_sole_trader.aspx

hello2007

Did you not noticed that they did not take tax and ni out of your pay?

Did you get a contact which would say if you are employed or self employed ?

The company will normally tell you that you are self employed because you will have to register for tax and ni. I have had interviews for postions that have set hours however I have been told at the interviews that the position is self employed. In the current job market you have to be very careful because employers are taking advantage of people.

Hammyman

InsideInsurance wrote: »

The difference would be that if your an employee what you employer gives you is the net figure where as if you are self employed your client gives you the gross amount.

Err, AND?

If the job is advertised at £300 a week, as an employee your gross is £300 a week and you're paid that less tax and NI. If you are self employed, you are paid the full £300 a week and you're responsible for paying your tax and NI, still ending up with the same net amount once you've put that aside.

The top line is still the same. The amount you end up with net is still the same. So again, please tell me where you pay extra tax and NI.