Biomass Boiler, incentives & alternatives

GordonGowk

I'm considering installing a biomass boiler - can you guys help me with the moneysaving and other logic to decide if it's my best option, please?
I'm off the gas grid and have a 50 year old range solid fuel stove that's falling apart. All the controls are jammed, the grate needs replaced, it's no good for cooking any more, but it does heat the house. I'm worried it will give up when we're next snowed in which would be desperate.
The hot water is also completely inadequate - a very small tank, in the wrong location, even the immersion's thermost is away.
I'm in a semi commercial building (village shop) so the hot water & heat is for both the house and for catering in a small commercial kitchen. The commercial hot tap needs 4 basins of water thrown away before the hot water comes so it's very wasterful.
So I'd like a new hot water tank, some rationalised plumbing and a reliable heat source that's up to the job.

I have few available funds, but could borrow.
I'm tempted with a biomass (pellet) boiler and the renewable heat incentive. If I get biomass just now I'm able to get an interest free loan for most/all of the cost. I'd probably be classed as business and could apply for the renewable heat incentive that's coming out this year. Fuel costs might be about £1800 pa, but the incentive would be about £2300 for that level of usage, therefore making up the additional installation cost. It would also be automatic and need very little of my time.

If I got a conventional solid fuel system, I'd have to borrow the funds and pay interest, although the job should cost about half the price. The interest would cost a few hundred each year, but the fuel would be cheaper (just now). I'd still be a slave to the stove all winter and there would be no automated controls so would no doubt waste a fair bit of heat.

Green ethics aside, it looks like the biomass option makes more financial sense in my case. Please could you check my logic because it's a really big outlay.

Thanks

[Deleted User]

we have a biomass stove, using wood pellets for running hot water plus ch. We use 1.5 tonnes a year and we have a code 5, 4 bed house ie the most insulated you can get. The pellets take up a lot of storage space. I am not expecting any great % return and anyway RHI came to our attention only after we bought the house. You need to take your property`s energy efficiency into account plus dry storage facilities. How did you get such a high incentive? The stove is powered by electricity and is automatic, running on programmes set by ourselves. It needs cleaning too and the hopper needs to be refilled. It takes 30 mins to power up and 30 mins to power down. If there is a power cut then you will have no heat and no more hot water, after your store is used up

Canucklehead

Good morning: see here and here for more on biomass.

HTH

Canucklehead

GordonGowk

Canucklehead - thanks for the links. I've been scouring the net for info on biomass on and off for about a year. Wish the EST would update their page though because it says the scheme will be launched last month, but it's not due till September 2011 now. The EST renewables advisor recommended the biomass system when he surveyed the house.

Kittie - thankyou too. I'm amazed how little fuel you need. I'm in an older property that used to be extremely draughty, but solved the draughts now - insulated everything I feasibly can including insulating the inside of exterior walls. Almost ran out of insulation opportunities. I'm a slave to the existing stove all winter as it is, and frequently light it in summer to get hot water - I have to clean it out most days, whereas the pellet boiler would need attention once every week or two. I already have a 4m3 indoor log store and 1/2 ton coal store, so the fuel storage is not an issue as when I take these out I'll have potential to store a vast amount if needed (could do up to about 12m3 at a push, but don't see the need). My existing stove runs during a powercut unfortunately as the radiator pump stops working so we need to constantly run-off hot water to save blasting the system to pieces. At least the new system might go out and refrain from causing damage! The incentive is the Renewable Heat Incentive due out in September for commercial premises - 7.6 p per kWh at 4800kWh/ton of wood pellets. Estimated use per anum for a 20kW boiler was 8 tons according to one website, but the installer thinks that was very high.

Has anyone else tried the technology or looked into it? Any opinions?

Martink149

Hi,
If you can get an interest free loan for the biomass install and the incentive is more than the cost of the fuel sounds like your seriously quids in. You mention the biomass is getting you £2300 pa in RHI and based on large domestic costs say the install is £6k? Pay's itself back within three years. Thats assuming the fuel costs of both options are the same and ignooring the extra interest you would be paying on the loan for fossil fuel heating. Ofcourse this is quick numbers but looks like a very decent option.

May I ask how you got an interest free loan for the install?

Cheers.

Gizmosmum_2

Martink149 wrote: »

Hi,
If you can get an interest free loan for the biomass install and the incentive is more than the cost of the fuel sounds like your seriously quids in. You mention the biomass is getting you £2300 pa in RHI and based on large domestic costs say the install is £6k? Pay's itself back within three years. Thats assuming the fuel costs of both options are the same and ignooring the extra interest you would be paying on the loan for fossil fuel heating. Ofcourse this is quick numbers but looks like a very decent option.

May I ask how you got an interest free loan for the install?

Cheers.

From what I've seen the cost of supply and installation seems to be more in the region fo 20 - 30k not 6. We're looking at a similar scenario but I'm considering just going donw the log burning route without the RHI - boiler around 3k supply only maybe another 1k to install.

grahamc2003

GordonGowk wrote: »

Fuel costs might be about £1800 pa, but the incentive would be about £2300 for that level of usage, therefore making up the additional installation cost.
Thanks

I thought the rhis hadn't been decided yet? Do you have a reference for your £2300ps subsidy figure?

The impression I have with these subsidies is that they seem to aim for a 10/12 year payback - a 2 to 3 year payback seems very overgenerous and out of kilter with other similar schemes.

getevenfromsteepleashton

I had a biomass boiler installed by an MCS registered installer who appeared to know what they were doing. However after contracting them to do the work which took 54days, and after the boiler overheated blowing all the solder out of the back and flooding my kitchen with boiling hot water and superheated steam. The morons reinstalled the appliance with the same fundamental fault. They demanded £6500 from me which thankfully I did not pay as the installation after more damage to both my nerves and the house was condemned by HETAS as unsafe. The company based in Chippenham Wiltshire continued to demand payment from me despite the report from HETAS until I contacted the Health and Safety Executive for the escape of a dangerous substance (hot water and steam). HETAS are not a legal body and offer you no legal protection at all. MCS refer to HETAS and basically Vertdegree could do as they pleased. Beware when you go for biomass.

GordonGowk

Apologies for my long silence - here's an update.

One 20kW pellet boiler, thermal store & various other bits of plumbing technology installed. Thankfully we have a very reputable local MCS installer and the work went fairly smoothly.
Cost was over £20k (ouch), but there was a lot of technology and we are semi commercial. Part funded by EST business loan.
The boiler is fantastic, could go for 2+ weeks unattended and it's amazing actually having hot water coming from the taps and a building that's actually warm when I want it to be. (Was often freezing at 12-15C in the winter with the very elderly solid fuel system before). The fuel cost is definitely less than before and I am saving a lot of time now I don't need to tend the stove - we all know that time is money!
Applying for the non-domestic RHI is a very daunting task and takes a lot of time, but the application is progressing - so long as it gets there I'll be happy. Sorting out the whole thing and doing the homework was a very long and difficult road, but glad I made the effort.

Canucklehead

Hi: brilliant news! Which pellet boiler did you go with in the end? We're still waiting for news on the domestic RHI.

Canucklehead

GordonGowk

Thank you.

It's an Ariterm Biomatic+ 20