Greece. Been Lied To .... £14,640/family might be the real amount.

michaels

Surely the point is the debt is already there - the Germans can bail out the German banks either by giving money to the Greeks so they don't default or letting the Greeks default and then bailing out the banks, the ECB and the IMF - either way they have to pay up - with the former there is less risk that they have to repeat the exercise for the Irish, Portuguese etc. And don't forget even if the UK is not too exposed to Greece I suspect we are on the hoc to a large extent to Eire and of course we have banking links to spain.

FTBFun

purch wrote: »

Doncha just love "Experts" :rotfl:

Slighty OT, but there is one thing I can't stand about the media in this country and that is the use of "Experts say......" - it's basically saying "these people know more than you so don't question it".

In the case of the Daily Mail it is not surprising as generally their readers like to be told what to think, but elsewhere it doesn't half annoy me.

HAMISH_MCTAVISH

Generali wrote: »

I keep saying it but if you take on enough debt from insolvent people you end up insolvent yourself!

And we'll continue to disagree on this one.

The risk is not that a few obscure financial institutions go bust, but rather that the contagion spreads to become systemic.

And that is a risk nobody can afford to take.

Radiantsoul

Generali wrote: »

I keep saying it but if you take on enough debt from insolvent people you end up insolvent yourself!

I guess the key word is "enough", most people seem to believe not bailing out Lehman's was a mistake.

Wookster

Generali wrote: »

Now it appears that Governments aren't going to be allowed to go bust either so the debts of a few small Greek banks that nobody gives a damn about and that would have sunk without leaving a ripple behind on the surface of the capitalist pool are going to end up on the books of the German Government (in effect) along with those of Irish and Portugese banks and then perhaps Italy and Spain followed by the French too.

I keep saying it but if you take on enough debt from insolvent people you end up insolvent yourself!

It is inconceivable that Greece will not default. As they say, you can take a horse to water but you can't make it drink. The Greeks are their own worst enemy and sooner or later they will succeed in shooting themselves in the knee, having already shot themselves in the foot. It is time to plan for a default.

At some point though, some bailout will be necessary as you clearly can't have a situation where contagion wipes out all the large financial institutions. Think of the calamity and chaos there would be in the aftermath.

Norfolk_Jim

This reminds me of that episode in South Park where little Stan Marsh goes in to open a savings account, deposits the money....and its gone.

tomterm8

vivatifosi wrote: »

Oh crikey, so you're telling me that this is yet another game of high stakes poker like the last unravelling, where everyone has a hand of cards but can't see what they are holding. That's even more scary:eek::eek:.

Yes... that is the general concern.

However, in many ways, the concern is worse, because if greece default in a disorderly way, the european central bank will be insolvent, and most greek banks will go tits up. At that stage, you have dozens of Lehman sized banks going bankrupt all at the same time. And the banks that insure the banks may also not be able to cover the debt.

In other words, the concern is that this will be worse than Lehman's.

I mean, Lehman was a tiny company, whereas, you are talking about the 24th largest economy in the world defaulting on its debts, and at the same time, an major countries banking system going Icelandic.

Loughton_Monkey

Norfolk_Jim wrote: »

This reminds me of that episode in South Park where little Stan Marsh goes in to open a savings account, deposits the money....and its gone.

Do Satander operate in USA then?

PasturesNew

Jennifer_Jane wrote: »

... saying the real problem is the domino effect (she had a special word for it) ....

!!!!!! creek?

kabayiri

I'm sure at some point someone will be along to explain that it's really all our fault, the little people. It's always down to our mad spending spree during the noughties. I still feel guilty about buying a few boxes of maltesers each month during 2007. The warning signs were there after all.

If all this does pan out as more the 'creek' model, then surely this will go down as possibly the biggest con trick in history, when the finance world managed to persuade western governments to bail them out of one almighty hole.