Wages divide widening, says TUC

DervProf

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-13663778

I think this needs to be considered when judging people's attitudes to the property market.

A "mere" fork lift truck driver or baker will no doubt "feel" HPI more than a lawyer, GP or accountant. The lawyer or accountant may well be able to quite easily afford a property or two, but the baker is likely to struggle to afford just one small place to live. Those than can afford property fairly easily are the ones that tend to champion HPI (there are a few in this forum, no doubt). They even tell the less well off that HPI is good for them, and in these times of tighter lending, call for the banks to lend ever larger amounts to "the little people", while considering their next BTL investment.

Personally, I think that a widening wages gap along with increasing costs of putting a roof over your head a sign of a country going backwards, not progressing.

Graham_Devon

Benefits top up a lot of these lower wages, dependant on family circumstances.

The people often forgotten are those who don't have entitlements to wages. Single people on low wages. Couples without children on low wages etc.

As benefits have risen and risen over the past couple of decades, wages have been allowed to fall back. So much so, its distorted the market severely and allowed low wages to continue.

chucky

DervProf wrote: »

I think this needs to be considered when judging people's attitudes to the property market.

that explains why the average wage is low compared the average property price. the 'haves' are benefiting more than the 'have nots'. that's not meant to sound harsh in any way.

DervProf wrote: »

Personally, I think that a widening wages gap along with increasing costs of putting a roof over your head a sign of a country going backwards, not progressing.

it's a lot more than the property market though; it's the education system, social development, people developing the right skills, people with financial backing benefiting more than those without etc...

wotsthat

Mr Barber says the nation's entire economy needs to be radically transformed."Unless we radically transform our economy - from recasting the role of the state to prioritising a fairer distribution of new wealth and jobs - we will simply be storing up more problems for the future."

It's funny; when I read articles like the OP my first thought is that I must make sure that my children work hard at school to improve their employability and life choices.

It's all so different if you work for a union when you think failure to compete should be rewarded by a sub from someone who succeeded.

The report itself is quite interesting but really states the obvious - those who work to gain real skills and qualifications put themselves at an advantage to those who don't.

DervProf

wotsthat wrote: »

The report itself is quite interesting but really states the obvious - those who work to gain real skills and qualifications put themselves at an advantage to those who don't.

True, but if everyone got a degree, who's going to bake the bread, or serve you in the takeaway ?*


*Some with degrees probably already do.

wotsthat

DervProf wrote: »

True, but if everyone got a degree, who's going to bake the bread, or serve you in the takeaway

That's why I said REAL skills and qualifications.

Take GCSE results which have been improving for something like 30 years. Does that mean the employability of school leavers has improved too? I'm sure employers don't think so.

DervProf

wotsthat wrote: »

That's why I said REAL skills and qualifications.

Take GCSE results which have been improving for something like 30 years. Does that mean the employability of school leavers has improved too? I'm sure employers don't think so.

I'm sure that is true.

My experience of education in recent years is that standards are slipping.

I have also wondered what all these media studies and sociology students are going to do when they get their qualifications.

And what's with the people I hear of who get a degree in history, then get a job as say a financial adviser or a manager of a large supermarket ? OK, getting a degree does display a certain level of intelligence/discipline, but why not study something that will be of actual use in the workplace ? Yes, I know that most people do study relevant subjects, but I have spoken to people who have degrees in subject that have very little to do with their job.

Mrs_Arcanum

The benefit system helps to prop up those at lower end of the pay scale. Those a bit better off pay more in taxes. Whilst those at the top are nicely cushioned from price increases. All in all making more people more unhappy with their lot in life.

Motoring costs have shot up by 20% in a year. Wonder if they will be included for inflation calculations.

DervProf

Mrs_Arcanum wrote: »

Motoring costs have shot up by 20% in a year. Wonder if they will be included for inflation calculations.

They have to be. Or do they ?.........

"The basket of goods used to calculate inflation has been adjusted today. Petrol and diesel have been removed from the calculations, as the economic slowdon has meant that many people are not using their vehicles so much. Extra large screen TVs have been added to the basket (it now contains 3 46" Plasmas), as the royal wedding meant that nearly everyone went out and bought at least one large TV, apart from Graham_Devon."

Percy1983

I am all up for using technology in the figures but surely it should be like for like. ie top end vs top end as what is top end constantly moves on while costs of lower products drops as new top end goods come out.

As for the gap in wages, its hardly shocking that more and more money goes to the top while the rest of the underlings find things harder and harder.

Loughton_Monkey

Typical TUC rantings.

It added that a significant proportion of workers have received little if any financial benefit from the doubling in size of the British economy in the last 30 years.

A fundamental misunderstanding of economics. This country chooses to measure 'the economy' virtually 100% using GDP only. This is the volume of money 'swishing around' our High Streets and has nothing whatsoever with the 'wealth' of the country - which has rapidly dwindled over 30 years.

The so-called 'doubling' of the economy is down to far more sandwich/coffee shops, restaurants, call centres, service jobs. The traditional stamping ground for the 'workers' [metal bashing, production line, assembly.....] has all but disappeared. They are lucky to have jobs at all baking bread, filling sandwiches, and servicing cars for the 'rich'.

As always, what 'wealth' remains in any economy, will tend to move towards the articulate, the educated, and the clever members of the population. What's new?

Here's an exercise for you.

Glance at the list of 'occupations' quoted in the survey. Go down them very thoroughly and see how many of these you think add to the wealth of UK [I don't mean the 'welfare'. I mean the hard cash earnings of UK Plc.]. Do you see Farmers/Fishermen? Factory owners? Miners? Shipping Company owners? A handful of engineers, maybe.

UK has virtually no wealth creators these days. Manufacturing and Mining has been lost for ever. Food production has been ruined by EEC over-regulation. Our mainstay of Financial Services is losing creidbility. What's realistically left for us? Biomedical Research, Drugs, Scientific Research? Personally, I struggle to work out where UK Plc. can earn a crust these days. On a worldwide scale, we are the 'bakers'!