Debate House Prices
In order to help keep the Forum a useful, safe and friendly place for our users, discussions around non MoneySaving matters are no longer permitted. This includes wider debates about general house prices, the economy and politics. As a result, we have taken the decision to keep this board permanently closed, but it remains viewable for users who may find some useful information in it. Thank you for your understanding.
We'd like to remind Forumites to please avoid political debate on the Forum. This is to keep it a safe and useful space for MoneySaving discussions. Threads that are - or become - political in nature may be removed in line with the Forum’s rules. Thank you for your understanding.
House ownership - Selling yourself into a lifetime of servitude
Comments
-
I'm surprised you haven't referred to "debt junkies" and the banks being "liars and thieves" yet.
Would it help you to dismiss my opinion if I did? Are you so afraid of people having an alternate view that you want to dismiss them without discussion?
If you look at the endebted nations, the top 10 are all countries where home ownership is pushed as the ultimate goal for success. Success to me is not to plough all my income into a brick cube, not to store all my wealth in a single asset, not to sign my future over to a faceless financial institution. If that scares you then I'm sorry.
Here are some soundbites to allow you to dismiss me and go back to the grind of paying down your mortgage. "People with mortgages are debt junkies", "banks are liars and thieves". I hope that when you get close to exchanging your brick box for a wooden box, you dont look back and wish you had chosen a different path.0 -
I've had a mortgage for 37 years in total but it’s all paid off now and I’m living rent-free in a house that would cost me £1200 a month to rent. That’s £14.4k a year I really feel like I’m in servitude especially since my Mortgage has been less than equivalent rent for at least 30 of those years0
-
debtistheft wrote: »How much financial sacrifice did it entail to have sufficient money to be able to do this? Why did you buy your 1st house and then move after only 3 years? How much did it cost you in those three years to buy and sell two houses?
Have you ever totalled up how much your two brick cubes have cost you, have you ever thought of what life-enhancing experiences or opportunities that cube money could have provided you and your family?
Got 1st house in 2003 a standard terraced. 3 years later was expecting a child so moved to a semi with a garden. At no point has the mortgage payments I have been making been above what I would have been paying in rent to live in an equivalent property. In 17 years (or less with over payments) I will be able to live rent free from the age of 52.0 -
I've had a mortgage for 37 years in total but it’s all paid off now and I’m living rent-free in a house that would cost me £1200 a month to rent. That’s £14.4k a year I really feel like I’m in servitude especially since my Mortgage has been less than equivalent rent for at least 30 of those years
This is my favourite piece of propaganda. You are not living rent free you have a large amount of money invested in your house and the return from that money is a roof over your head.
In economies that are not based in mortgage debt, people invest their wealth in shares and government bonds instead of a house. This money allows companies to invest in machinery, advetising, innovation which in turn creates jobs and wealth for the whole society. In economies based on home ownership a vast amount of wealth is invested in something that produces nothing.
By the time you have paid off your mortgage you will have paid down the principle sum, paid a large amount of interest, paid associated costs for buying and selling homes, paid mortgage arrangement fees, paid bank adminstration fees, etc. All this money could be invested in the economy and easily cover the rent on a similar house.
All of this supposes that you dont have any problems in that 35 years such as a job loss or illness. With all your wealth tied up in a property, how will you keep a roof over your head, how will you feed your family. A year of being jobless or ill and you could lose it all.0 -
In 17 years (or less with over payments) I will be able to live rent free from the age of 52.
You are planning your life 17 years in advance and don't even see it. You are not living 'rent free', you are simply investing all your wealth into a single asset and the 'return' from that asset is a roof over your head. Nothing is free. You could just as easily invest your money in shares and not only will this stimulate the economy and provide jobs, but it would have a return that would pay rent and provide a roof over your head.
What happens if you get ill or lose your job in that 17 years? Do you think the banks will feel sorry for you and not take your house? After their 'administration charges' do you think that there will be much of your investment left? Do you think bad things only ever happen to bad people?0 -
To me the most desirable thing is not having all the trappings of wealth but to be financially independent. That is to have sufficient money to be comfortable and most importantly the time to enjoy things.
If you rent you are less likely to obtain this as the costs are always there and just increase over time. Yes you can try and play the market to try and time it but given all the factors that are out of your control this is a gamble. If you chose to do this good luck.
Owning and paying off the mortgages is to me the best way. Inflation works in your favor, the reducing balance reduces your cost over time. Once it is paid your most significant cost has disappeared. You will of course still need some other source of income but free accommodation (excluding maintenance which is minimal for most) means that this doesn't need to be that large in order to live comfortably.0 -
debtistheft wrote: »Funny, but ask yourself if German people are suffering from having an economy that isnt based in property and debt? Are they back in the middle ages?
You are so deeply embeded in the system that you cant see any alternatives and you feel threatened if others suggest alternatives.
I own some flats near Radekow in Eastern Germany (I'm not a fat cat though and not rich). Although out in the Berlin hinterland, ownership proportion is only 50%, in what was Western Germany, the proportion of owner occupiers is very similar to the UK, at about 75%.
CAN I ASK YOU THIS > Why do you think the peasants in the 17thc clubbed together to form the first Building Societies so they could 'free' themselves from a life of serfdom and being at the whim of a land owner / landlord?0 -
debtistheft wrote: »
What happens if you get ill or lose your job in that 17 years? Do you think the banks will feel sorry for you and not take your house?
Whereas your trusty warm hearted landlord will be all sympathy:rotfl:
All life is a balance of risks. Just because we are Human life does not entitle us to a risk free existence.0 -
debtistheft wrote: »Its rare to find anyone who takes out a 25 year mortgage and then stays in that house for the lifetime of the loan. We are encouraged to 'climb the ladder', forever extending the length of the mortgage and the size of the loan. The manipulators sell us all a dream of success and happiness based on the size of your brick cube. Madness.
Granted in some cases but for many people the passing of 25/30 years brings about many changes including increasing of salary, when we got our mortgage my Husband and myself were earning 9k between us, by the time we had finished paying our mortgage our salaries has gone way up but our mortgage payments has remained steady - for instance in 2008 I was paying nearly £800 per month
tax and NI and my husband slightly less, if we had decided in say 2001 to sell and get a bigger property in London we could have done so, we had savings and the salary to take on a bigger mortgage plus at that time we would have had about 100k equity on our flat as I said we were lucky but then again so are 1000s of others we were not in the minority.
And as for equating happiness and success with the type of property you live in well its not just homeowners who think like that.
Read any thread or discussion about buying v renting and you will see numerous posts from people who prefer to rent rather than buy for the simple reason is that they want to live in a better house, nicer area, have a nicer view etc then any property they could afford a mortage on, the only difference between them and the people who have a mortgage is that they are in effect renting their lifestyle, they will never own it and guess what when they can no longer afford the rent they will have to move into the grotty backstreet type of property that they spent a lifetime renting to avoid0 -
debtistheft you seem to be of religious bent.
in that case you must think we are all tenants since the earth does not belong to us.
also, if the real and eternal life is yet to come a 30 year mortgage doesn't really touch the sides of significance does it?Those who will not reason, are bigots, those who cannot, are fools, and those who dare not, are slaves. - Lord Byron0
This discussion has been closed.
Confirm your email address to Create Threads and Reply

Categories
- All Categories
- 348.2K Banking & Borrowing
- 252.1K Reduce Debt & Boost Income
- 452.4K Spending & Discounts
- 240.8K Work, Benefits & Business
- 617K Mortgages, Homes & Bills
- 175.6K Life & Family
- 254K Travel & Transport
- 1.5M Hobbies & Leisure
- 16K Discuss & Feedback
- 15.1K Coronavirus Support Boards