Buy to let replacing first time buyers

IveSeenTheLight

ultrawomble wrote: »

The point is that there is NO mortgage rationing. Similarly Rolls Royce's aren't rationed. Either you can afford the product or you can't. The suggestion that FTBs are being prevented from getting on the ladder due to 'mortgage rationing' is just hot air.

I bought my first property in 2000 with a 100% mortgage.
If mortgages are not rationed, where can I get a similar product?

There are indeed rationed by the criteria set to allow to borrow.

That said, I think the last 20 years was an anomoly and we are returning to an era of fewer owners (as a percentage), fewer oppertunities to purchase and therefore increased renters

ultrawomble

IveSeenTheLight wrote: »

I bought my first property in 2000 with a 100% mortgage.
If mortgages are not rationed, where can I get a similar product?

There are indeed rationed by the criteria set to allow to borrow.

Rationing suggests that everybody is entitled to a minimum amount. Clearly that is not the case. You are allowed what you can afford to 'buy'.

Graham_Devon

IveSeenTheLight wrote: »

I bought my first property in 2000 with a 100% mortgage.
If mortgages are not rationed, where can I get a similar product?

There are indeed rationed by the criteria set to allow to borrow.

That said, I think the last 20 years was an anomoly and we are returning to an era of fewer owners (as a percentage), fewer oppertunities to purchase and therefore increased renters

It's restricted, due to new eligibility requirements.

That's not rationed.

If mortgages were rationed, we would all be entitled to a set amount each.

Definitions of rationing on the Web:

• the act of rationing; "during the war the government imposed rationing of food and gasoline"
  wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn
• Rationing is the controlled distribution of scarce resources, goods, or services. Rationing controls the size of the ration, one's allotted portion of the resources being distributed on a particular day or at a particular time.
  en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rationing
• Rationing is a 1944 film starring Wallace Beery and Marjorie Main. The screen comedy was directed by Willis Goldbeck.
  en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rationing_(1944_film)
• rationed - distributed equitably in limited individual portions; "got along as best we could on rationed meat and sugar"

It's also a film. Apparently.

IveSeenTheLight

ultrawomble wrote: »

Rationing suggests that everybody is entitled to a minimum amount. Clearly that is not the case. You are allowed what you can afford to 'buy'.

Graham_Devon wrote: »

It's restricted, due to new eligibility requirements.

That's not rationed.

If mortgages were rationed, we would all be entitled to a set amount each.
.

Those are of course one definition of rationing, assuming there is sufficient for all.
Alternatively, by imposing restrictions, you are rationing the supply.

To try and explain in your terms, the next time you see a disaster on TV and aid people rationing the supply they have, think about those that are left there withiout any rations after the supply was distributed.

Running_Horse

When we sold there were a fair few BTL buyers, sniffing for a seller in trouble, which we weren't. Despite being at the height of the market, there were few FTBs, who were more interested in suburban houses than our old terrace. Luckily we found a normal buyer willing to pay a fair price. Much as I dislike BTL landlords, they are often buying the type of properties rejected by FTBs.

ultrawomble

IveSeenTheLight wrote: »

To try and explain in your terms, the next time you see a disaster on TV and aid people rationing the supply they have, think about those that are left there withiout any rations after the supply was distributed.

Since there's nothing left, they'll get nothing. However, in this instance BTL investors are being able to obtain mortgages - so there must be some money left in the system. They can obviously afford the product, whereas the FTBs can't. No rationing there as far as I can see.

Running_Horse

IveSeenTheLight wrote: »

I bought my first property in 2000 with a 100% mortgage.
If mortgages are not rationed, where can I get a similar product?

Our mortgage product is still available; just costs 10% more now.

Products change. Not so long ago nearly every mortgage had an endowment attached. For a while 100% products were available. Then trackers became the norm. If rates look set to rise fixed terms may gain in popularity.

I don't think that's rationing, just a changing market.

Graham_Devon

IveSeenTheLight wrote: »

Those are of course one definition of rationing, assuming there is sufficient for all.
Alternatively, by imposing restrictions, you are rationing the supply.

To try and explain in your terms, the next time you see a disaster on TV and aid people rationing the supply they have, think about those that are left there withiout any rations after the supply was distributed.

Oh good grief.

Aid is rationed to those most in need.

There is no mortgage rationing. There IS mortgage eligibility.

100% mortgages are not being rationed. They are simply not there. They have been removed at the present time.

Gorgeous_George

One answer would be to reintroduce MIRAS (mortgage interest rellief at source) for FTBers or perhaps for people under 30 whether a FTBer or not.

It could be simple and would give the younger generation a little encouragement.

GG

geneer

julieq wrote: »

Geneer, you utter plank, this is what I said would happen and the article suggests it's happening (but I'll wait for metrics before declaring myself vindicated).

Indeed. Lets wait for the facts.;)
Though kudos for your ability to relate VI memes.
An ability thats in short supply amongst bulls.

julieq wrote: »

Investors are sustaining the market as a function of yield. As rents rise and yield rises, prices will rise, with a floor set by acceptable ROI levels. As savings rates are low, and rental income is relatively low risk, BTL is a very attractive investment (as it was in Jan 2009 when I pointed this out to widespread derision). There is also a very real prospect of capital growth in the shortish medium term.

When mortgage availability increases and prospective buyers have saved up deposits there will be more upwards pressure still. I think I used the term "coiled spring" previously.

Now it may be difficult for you to get this into your 3" thick skull, but if you create more households than you create homes then you are going to see the cost of accomodation increasing. If you prevent a section of the population buying, then someone will provide rental accomodation. That is a simple statement of fact.

Blah blah blah supply and demand blah blah blah.
Again, you mistake the desire for BTL muppets to charge what they want for an ability to do so.

The market will find an equilibrium based on numerous factors.
But its not the simplistic one way train you keep stuggling to describe.