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Oh Dear!

12467

Comments

  • ILW
    ILW Posts: 18,333 Forumite
    StevieJ wrote: »
    How can you pay less tax than being bailed out :)

    Some truth to that.

    You just get a situation where the failing ones stay and the profitable ones take their business elsewhere.

    I believe though that the taxpayer should get most of the bailout money back with interest.
  • Generali
    Generali Posts: 36,411 Forumite
    10,000 Posts Combo Breaker
    chucky wrote: »
    you best tell David Cameron and the rest of his monkeys - everytime he doesn't have an answer he harps on about the mess left to him by the previous government.

    In the 80s and 90s it worked for the Tories. The Winter of Discontent in 78-79 and the IMF bailout of 1976 were strong folk memories of the incompetence of Labour Government. Whether that was entirely fair is immaterial really.

    Messers Blair & Brown tried to do the same thing in turn referring to the previous Tory Governments. Tory cuts vs Labour investment. IMO Tory sleaze would have resonated more strongly with people but they won a lot of elections, basically on the premise that they could ramp up public services by spending the proceeds of growth rather than by increasing tax levels.

    Now in turn, Mr Cameron and his Merrie Men are trying to say that Labour have effectively bankrupted the economy. They are banging on about it because that's how politicians have done things for the past 30 years at least.

    It all seems a bit uninspiring really if the message is, "If you think we're bad then remember the other lot last time they had a turn!".
  • chucky
    chucky Posts: 15,170 Forumite
    10,000 Posts Combo Breaker
    Generali wrote: »
    It all seems a bit uninspiring really if the message is, "If you think we're bad then remember the other lot last time they had a turn!".
    it is getting quite boring and shows that most of these politicians are all basically same except for the party they represent.
  • Generali
    Generali Posts: 36,411 Forumite
    10,000 Posts Combo Breaker
    chucky wrote: »
    it is getting quite boring and shows that most of these politicians are all basically same except for the party they represent.

    The problem is that there isn't a battle of ideology any more. The main parties in most countries seem to believe in some form of corporatist capitalism.

    Big companies churn out big profits and pay packets that you can then tax heavily in order to finance a very large Government sector.

    The argument seems to be over who is the best set of managers. Dull, dull, dull.

    If one thing is likely to come out of the big changes to the world's economy likely to result from the rise of many emerging economies it's a bit more ideology as Westerners try to hang on to their standard of living in the face of a static supply of oil and a bunch of people in Asia willing to bid up the price.
  • chucky
    chucky Posts: 15,170 Forumite
    10,000 Posts Combo Breaker
    Generali wrote: »
    The problem is that there isn't a battle of ideology any more. The main parties in most countries seem to believe in some form of corporatist capitalism.

    Big companies churn out big profits and pay packets that you can then tax heavily in order to finance a very large Government sector.

    The argument seems to be over who is the best set of managers. Dull, dull, dull.

    If one thing is likely to come out of the big changes to the world's economy likely to result from the rise of many emerging economies it's a bit more ideology as Westerners try to hang on to their standard of living in the face of a static supply of oil and a bunch of people in Asia willing to bid up the price.
    you're right.

    the election was very similar to a presidential campaign instead of what was good for the country and economy.
  • Generali
    Generali Posts: 36,411 Forumite
    10,000 Posts Combo Breaker
    chucky wrote: »
    you're right.

    the election was very similar to a presidential campaign instead of what was good for the country and economy.

    The trouble with this sort of cosy consensus is that nobody is examining the structure of how things work.

    Nobody wants to reform the NHS in any serious way, it remains sacrosanct despite it being massively expensive and perhaps not very good compared to other systems (e.g. Australia's). Planning laws are crazy and a real disincentive to growth. State education is patchy. The biggest predictor of your income is your Dad's income. Welfare spending is huge. Nobody seems to be sure if the UK is a regional power or a international minnow.

    None of this stuff ever gets discussed in any kind of meaningful way. Nobody is called on to defend the status quo because all five parties (if you include the Welsh and Scots Nationalists) believe in the status quo in effect.
  • StevieJ
    StevieJ Posts: 20,174 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Combo Breaker
    Generali wrote: »
    Now in turn, Mr Cameron and his Merrie Men are trying to say that Labour have effectively bankrupted the economy. They are banging on about it because that's how politicians have done things for the past 30 years at least.

    It all seems a bit uninspiring really if the message is, "If you think we're bad then remember the other lot last time they had a turn!".

    I have to say one of my favourite times of govt was 1997-2000 when Labour ran with the Tory spending plans, almost a coalition :)
    Extracts from United Kingdom - 2000 Article IV Consultation
    Concluding Statement of the Mission

    "1. The overall performance of the U.K. economy remains impressive. Output is growing at a brisk pace, the unemployment rate is at its lowest level in a quarter century (...) These achievements reflect ... sound macroeconomic policie.
    'Just think for a moment what a prospect that is. A single market without barriers visible or invisible giving you direct and unhindered access to the purchasing power of over 300 million of the worlds wealthiest and most prosperous people' Margaret Thatcher
  • Niksan
    Niksan Posts: 309 Forumite
    Read this - this morning, http://johannhari.com/2011/03/29/the-biggest-lie-in-british-politics

    an interesting view, but not sure where I stand on all this cuts versus using debt to get us out of the crisis, I'm not sure if the author is anti-conlib or pro labour but I don't think the parties are the same apart from blaming each other that is and seemingly going against what they say in thier manifestos, I think we're the product of being on a pendulum as we suffer the fate of each parties ideals to dealing with the status-quo.

    As for the bigger coporations paying more tax, I think if there wasn't a multitude of taxation with several levels of loopholes, everything would be fair. As for the northern oil fiasco, everything seems to be heading toward a bait and switch state.

    There, I've fulfilled my daily quota for talking rubish about random nothingness.
  • ess0two
    ess0two Posts: 3,606 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 1,000 Posts Name Dropper
    StevieJ wrote: »
    Hope it all works out icon9.gif Shell have also removed a large number of staff abroad in recent years and there is even talk of selling the petrol stations, sad days.

    The aviation side of things is all that will keep the Shell brand,although all jet fuel will be supplied by Essar.

    I think part of the deal includes retail outlets.

    I've probably got a 5 year window,time to move on.
    Official MR B fan club,dont go............................
  • Thrugelmir
    Thrugelmir Posts: 89,546 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper Photogenic
    StevieJ wrote: »
    I have to say one of my favourite times of govt was 1997-2000 when Labour ran with the Tory spending plans, almost a coalition :)

    By raiding the pension funds though. Something which we will come back to haunt GB once the full Treasury documents are released in due course.
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