Yule, twelve nights and winter solstice for Pagans

amosworks

Hey folks,

Well since the Christians decided to rape and pillage our ancient holiday festivals and rebrand them under something to do with the birth of christ or whatever that's all about, I thought it would be nice to start a thread relating to the original real festival of Yule. i.e., the festival occuring around 21st December that celebrates the waxing of the sun and the return of life. It would be nice to share some MSE ideas for things relating to what the winter holiday is really about, and all the activities and celebrations that go with it.

Of course y'all know that the pagan Yule was the source of traditions like giving gifts to each other, decorating trees, burning a yule log, laying wreaths, watching for Odin & Sleipnir (now called santa claus and reindeer), kissing under mistletoe, carolling, lighting candles, watching the sun rise, eating lots, drinking lots and generally getting naked and having a great time and partying on down hard. (Seems strange how the Christians think they own all that when it was old tradition long before Christianity itself was even invented lol).

I'd really like to share some ideas on how to do some of these things MSE stylee. I'm going to make a very strong point this year to avoid the commercial fake plastic tat and crap that shops import - I really don't want that filth in my home. I want to get a real tree cheaply and make my own traditional Yule decorations for it. Also hopefully decorations that don't need energising with 230v just to look ok. I would like to find places where I can cheaply get traditional decorations for inside my home, mainly real live holly, ivy and mistletoe.

I also want to share some ideas on cheap but traditional pagan gifts to give to my friends and family that weren't made in China and Taiwan and that won't damage the environment. It'd be nice to make my own environmentally friendly wrapping paper or find other nicer ways of giving gifts without all the awful packaging that most stuff comes in these days.

I want a nice Yule log but have nowhere to really set fire to it in my home to leave it burning for 12 days lol, and I have no Ash on my property to make one. It's quite wrong to go out and buy one but is ok to receive one as a gift from somebody. Maybe we could arrange some type of secret-santa Yule log giving circle?

I also want to share any other tips, hints and ideas on this most important on festivals and of course find ways to celebrate it MSE.

Plus it would be nice to read about other people's Yule rituals, ceremonies, blessings and blots so I can make this year a bit more interesting than last year lol.

Blessed be,
Amos

pavlovs_dog

come on spendless, move along.. this is a local thread for local people :rotfl:and you jayjay.. i see you lurking there. there's nothing to see here

bluemoon_3

Amos,
Just as you assert that Christians are mistaken in attributing certain traditions to their religion, I would also suggest that you are mistaken in attributing all the traditions you've listed as solely Pagan in origin. Even from my limited reading, it's clear to me that most of our modern day traditions and beliefs do not have as straight and clear-cut a line through history as the preacher (or oral/written histories) of any religion would have you believe. Human belief systems are far more wonderful and complex than that.

margaretclare

amosworks wrote:

Well since the Christians decided to rape and pillage our ancient holiday festivals and rebrand them under something to do with the birth of christ or whatever that's all about, I thought it would be nice to start a thread relating to the original real festival of Yule. i.e., the festival occuring around 21st December that celebrates the waxing of the sun and the return of life. It would be nice to share some MSE ideas for things relating to what the winter holiday is really about, and all the activities and celebrations that go with it.

Of course y'all know that the pagan Yule was the source of traditions like giving gifts to each other, decorating trees, burning a yule log, laying wreaths, watching for Odin & Sleipnir (now called santa claus and reindeer), kissing under mistletoe, carolling, lighting candles, watching the sun rise, eating lots, drinking lots and generally getting naked and having a great time and partying on down hard. (Seems strange how the Christians think they own all that when it was old tradition long before Christianity itself was even invented lol).

Much of what you say is not only offensive but completely wrong and mistaken.

I don't think Christianity or Christians 'hi-jacked' any of your old traditions at all. They simply carried on side by side.

For us Christians, Christmas has nothing to do with santa claus, reindeer, buying presents or any of the other things that you list. It certainly has nothing to do with any of the more modern accretions such as Rudolf the red-nosed reindeer (a 1950s pop song), Santa Claus in a red-and-white costume (invented by Coca Cola in their colours in the 1920s). For us, Christmas is about a special Baby born in very humble circumstances in the Middle East and what he came to do for us. That's what Christians celebrate. I know you don't want to know that - you'd rather blame us for all the things you list that you don't like, but it's a fact.

The trouble is that most of the people rushing around feeling obliged to spend money on what you describe as 'plastic tat', putting up trees, buying presents for people they'd rather not buy for, hanging lighted snowmen outside their houses, and all the rest of it - are neither Christians nor pagans, nor anything else either. We have been taken over by commercialism and the need to spend more at this time of year just to keep the economy going. After all, someone has gotta pay for those shiploads of 'plastic tat from China' and it doesn't matter if it's bought by people who can't afford it - 'it's that time of year again' so obey the ads on TV and keep spending!

The Baby whose birth we celebrate, who grew into a Man who is our Lord and Saviour, would not approve of all this - he drove the money-changers out of the Temple because, he said, they had made the house of prayer into a den of thieves. So, as a Christian, I don't get involved in any of this frenetic spending and only do a few things to keep in touch with people I value.

I have the greatest respect for anyone whose beliefs are sincerely and genuinely held, provided they don't try to thrust them down my throat. However, there is no need to be as offensive as you've been, and that's something I don't respect.

Margaret

gargoyle

Recarding the yule log - I thought the tradition was to go and look for one and the one that "spoke" to you was the one.This one you would take home and burn for reasons known to you. If that is the case, then how can it be the same if someone just gives you one?

magpie-c13

Hi Amos, tempted to ignore your post until I read you smugly noting that no pagans had yet replied. Firstly, as not all posters stated their religion you cannot be sure they were not pagan. Secondly, a pagan is now responding in complete agreement with most of the other people who have so far replied.

I don't doubt that you've spent a fair amount of time swatting up on Norse mythology, but not enough to realise that Heathenry (of which Odinism is an example) is not representative of the Pagan tradition as practised in most parts of the UK (both historically and presently). Paganism is distinctly not a 'closed shop', there are Pagans of many traditions and, as I've argued in previous posts on this board that you've obviously missed, some Christians also identify themselves as Pagan and vice versa - worshipping multiple gods is not a pre-requisite. Secondly, your analysis of the Christianisation of Yule is factually muddled and plays straight into the hands of those who would paint modern Pagans as bitter loons who simply wish to rebel against society. Most scholars of Paganism would agree that there are two main tenets of belief that the various traditions hold in common - a reverence for nature and a non-judgemental, peaceful attitude. You have displayed little knowledge of the former requirement and none of the latter.

Jay-Jay_4

Cristmas for my family is about eating a lot, drinking a lot, giving each other presents, looking at pretty lights and having a nice time. It goes no deeper and is certainly not driven by religion or pressure from TV adverts. It's convenient to have a party once a year at Christmas time and we enjoy seeing our children get excited about it.

The good thing about life is that we each get to make our own decisions, the good thing about this site is that we can each share our opinion regardless of whether the OP wants to hear it or not.



This probably would've stayed on topic and been the source of a great deal of interesting ideas and thoughts but the first comments were so rudely answered it will probably turn into an argument. Shame really as it started out quite interesting.

freebie_junkie

i dont have any religion but my family are Romany Gypsy and there are many lovely traditions around Christmas, weddings, births etc. that i like to observe. i love to know all about different rituals and religions and i think that amoswork's posts are narrow-minded and ignorant. teh reason why people fear things is that they dont know abotu them and that leads to prejudice and hatred. many people say bad things about Romanies and Travellers becuase tehy dont understand them. im always happy to discuss my heratige with other people and i love to hear about their heratige too.

i celebrate Christmas liek many others do, i love teh tacky decoartions and spending time with my family and friends, exchanging gifts, eating and spendign time togther. thsi doesnt mean that i am ignorant as to how others celebrate and the different religious celebrations that also take place at this time of year. i respect all people's beliefs, traditions and how they choose to or not to celeberate.

magpie-c13

You're on the right track Newcook! Although there are no hard and fast rules for this kind of thing, many people wanting to celebrate the Winter Solstice would be decorating their trees and homes with things they've found or recycled. Pinecones are ideal, as is a bit of holly or ivy from your local park (if it's plentiful). You can make loads of things into Christmas decorations; scrap paper can be used to make paper snowflakes: fold a square of paper in half several times, use scissors to trim the outer parts to make a curve, then cut bits out and unfold - surely everyone has fond memories of doing this in Primary school! I'd say the key is to make or obtain your decorations with as little lasting harm to the environment as possible.

newcook

magpie-c13 wrote:

You're on the right track Newcook! Although there are no hard and fast rules for this kind of thing, many people wanting to celebrate the Winter Solstice would be decorating their trees and homes with things they've found or recycled. Pinecones are ideal, as is a bit of holly or ivy from your local park (if it's plentiful). You can make loads of things into Christmas decorations; scrap paper can be used to make paper snowflakes: fold a square of paper in half several times, use scissors to trim the outer parts to make a curve, then cut bits out and unfold - surely everyone has fond memories of doing this in Primary school! I'd say the key is to make or obtain your decorations with as little lasting harm to the environment as possible.

Phew! Thanks for that - I thought I was going to have to leave with my tail between my legs as I am not a pagen and therefore not welcome!!!
I used to love doing things like that at school - making holly and berry door decorations (cant for the life of me remember what they are called!), paper snowflakes, coloured pine cones, I think we even used to dig out the conkers from a couple of months before and glue glitter all over them...!

Freebee-Junkie I have to say, until I read your sig I just thought you typed fast! (sorry me bieng ignorant again! - perhaps I should change my name to Ignorant cook!)

lindadykes

I am a pagan, but I respect the religious traditions of others and would hope that they will do likewise for my beliefs. If however someone does not respect my beliefs that is not my problem, it is theirs, and I will not allow someone elses predjudice to influence my way of thinking. Having said that they are entitled to their opinions and beliefs. I think what I am trying to say is that we should all tolerate other points of view and respect the right of others to their personal beliefs. The one thing I dislike is anyone trying to "convert" another to their way of religious thinking, to me your religion is a personal matter between you and your god or gods or godesses. We can none of us prove conclusively the existence of any god, and religion will always be a matter of faith. Each person should have the right to make up their own mind what they believe or don't believe and we should all try to display tolerance and respect for the beliefs of others. Surely it is not important as to the origin of any particular tradition, but what that tradition means in the here and now to you personally. There will always be crossover between the religious traditions and to argue over ownership serves no good to anyone. I see the yule as the birth of the light in the turning of the season and the begining of the longer day, a christian sees it as the birth of a saviour, there are similarities yes and surely the message from both traditions is the celebration of renewed hope. Let's try to focus on commonalities and share the goodwill of the season rather than being disrespectful to one another.

On a slightly different note can I just congratulate freebie_junkie for the honesty about dyslexia, and the courage I know it takes to commit yourself to text in public - my brother has dyslexia and I am a teacher of Special Education Needs, so I know how difficult it can be to come to terms with this and become comfortable writing in a public arena.