Nuclear power

ninky_2

Kohoutek wrote: »

Our society can't run on energy that's only available when it's sunny. At best it's half a day, in Britain it's much less than that on average.

that shows ignorance of solar. you don't only have available energy when it's sunny. the energy is harnessed from the sun (not just when it's sunny) and stored for use when needed. this is why you can have feed in tarifs from solar - you can actually end up with more energy than you need for your own house.

btw i didn't say all comsumption would become virtual just an increasing percentage.

Niv

ninky wrote: »

well i think we need to reduce requirements. some of this could maybe happen as we switch to virtual goods consumption (apps, internet etc) rather than manufactured goods consumption (infinite numbers of shoes, mountains of plastic toys etc). my other suggestion is fewer people through voluntary abstinence from breedign since i don't think lifestyle change is particularly palatable - although maybe some would rather live dark ages style if it allowed them to breed willy nilly.

and then renewables. mainly solar.

This is now turning away slightly from the Nuclear debabte. But, how do you think this could actually be implimented? The fact is people will NOT reduce thier wants significantly enough quick enough to make renewables viable in the near future.

I would love mankind to be able to live on the planet and have minimal impact on nature etc

Coming up with wonderful ideas that do not invlove nuclear are great, however, they simply will not work imo. Someone has already said that will could have rolling blackouts by 2015 if the next round of nuclear plants is delayed any longer (may of been you even - not sure). Your ideas will not be in place in time simple as. Maybe when the next generation of nuclear power plants have run their course we may be in a better position to not build more.

ninky_2

Niv wrote: »

This is now turning away slightly from the Nuclear debabte. But, how do you think this could actually be implimented? The fact is people will NOT reduce thier wants significantly enough quick enough to make renewables viable in the near future.

I would love mankind to be able to live on the planet and have minimal impact on nature etc

Coming up with wonderful ideas that do not invlove nuclear are great, however, they simply will not work imo. Someone has already said that will could have rolling blackouts by 2015 if the next round of nuclear plants is delayed any longer (may of been you even - not sure). Your ideas will not be in place in time simple as. Maybe when the next generation of nuclear power plants have run their course we may be in a better position to not build more.

resorting to the energy version of the 'welfare state' with nuclear (i.e. there is such a thing as a free lunch, you can go on having more more more forever) will not solve the problem it will only make it worse. rolling blackouts might actually solve the problem in that they will make people realise resources are finite - the choice is fewer of us or increasing conflict over what's left.

Kohoutek

ninky wrote: »

that shows ignorance of solar. you don't only have available energy when it's sunny. the energy is harnessed from the sun (not just when it's sunny) and stored for use when needed.

I think you're a lost cause if you think that's how solar power works. Unless you have a separate energy storage system, no electrical energy is stored.

ninky_2

Kohoutek wrote: »

I think you're a lost cause if you think that's how solar power works. Unless you have a separate energy storage system, no electrical energy is stored.

here you go.....

http://www.solar-energy-at-home.com/how-is-solar-energy-stored.html

Kohoutek

ninky wrote: »

here you go.....

http://www.solar-energy-at-home.com/how-is-solar-energy-stored.html

You just proved my last point....

Niv

ninky wrote: »

resorting to the energy version of the 'welfare state' with nuclear (i.e. there is such a thing as a free lunch, you can go on having more more more forever) will not solve the problem it will only make it worse. rolling blackouts might actually solve the problem in that they will make people realise resources are finite - the choice is fewer of us or increasing conflict over what's left.

Could you actually give me an answer on how you propose this to be achieved?

How do you intend there to be a lower enough population by 2015?

What sort of increased conflict are you suggesting we pursue?

I totally agree we cannot go on using more and more energy forever. I feel that fundamentally we are on a similar page, however I believe that we need nuclear suplemented with renewables going forward at this time where you do not. We seem to want the same outcome but have different views on the best way to 'get there' (I have also responded to your other thread regarding nuclear).

Niv

ninky_2

Kohoutek wrote: »

You just proved my last point....

i think i said the energy had to be stored. perfectly acceptable technology exists for doing this and is part of any solar installation. lots of roadside lights are currently charged up by solar in the day and then come on at night. same for increasing numbers of shipping lights. point is you don't just have power while the sun shines.

ninky_2

Niv wrote: »

Could you actually give me an answer on how you propose this to be achieved?

How do you intend there to be a lower enough population by 2015?

What sort of increased conflict are you suggesting we pursue?

I totally agree we cannot go on using more and more energy forever. I feel that fundamentally we are on a similar page, however I believe that we need nuclear suplemented with renewables going forward at this time where you do not. We seem to want the same outcome but have different views on the best way to 'get there' (I have also responded to your other thread regarding nuclear).

Niv

why 2015 in particular? is this when the oil is supposed to run out? or is it some carbon target? personally i'm not much one for carbon targets as i'm a carbon-related climate change skeptic (not that i think it isn't happening at all i just think there are bigger natural factors impacting on climate).

Niv

2015 (I believe - may be misread by myself) is when we (as a nation) would need to start building new nuclear plants (or some sort of mass power generation) as the old ones are coming to the end of thier life. I wasnt suggesting oil was running out. So do you believe that we need more fossel fuel power plants until the renewables and the message to reduce consumption has 'got through'? I dont care much for carbon targets either, made up nonsense, all that happens is nations trade their 'spare carbon allowances' - stupid political nonsense.

Couldnt agree more regarding carbon related climate change. Sure it is happening and sure we are contributing However these things happened before mankind was on the planet and it will happen after we are gone (unless us going involves blowing the place up - which I dont put past us doing).