KEY FACT ILLUSTRATIONS CON or What?

pineman

Meeper wrote: »

Depending on when the initial contract was taken, TCF and the outcomes may not have been in force, so that might not be a viable route of complaint.

This problem has been since MAS took over the Morgage only three years ago.

pineman

Conrad wrote: »

I'd say you do have a case.

Check out the 6 principles (often called the 6 'outcomes') laid down by the FSA known as 'Treating Customers Fairly'.

The problem with Ombudsman staff is they do not always apply these principles as I suspect they just forget them, dont know enough about them, but these 6 principles MUST be obeyed by lenders.

I agree that you as LAY PERSON would have no cause to suspect a reputable lender with the 6 TCF outcomes at the core of thier culture, would willy nilly change important terms buried in a fairly compex document.

You should have had a separate clear letter in good time AND BEFORE YOU HAD MENTALY AND EMMOTIONALY COMMITED to the process of the application.

This is akin to agreeing the price of a car and then in the last moment when you go to collect it, the garage inserting small text on page 3 saying an extra levy is now due, once you'd emmotionaly committed time and energy to the deal and had not expected a last moment tangent.

Fuk, the Ombudsman, go straight to the FSA - Lord Turner - is the head. Send it 'Special Delivery'.

My first port of call was the FSA. They just refered me to the Ombudsman..so no luck there. They said they only deal with the lenders not the public. I guess it's the lenders that pay them.....

betmunch

Hang on a mo, this is what is stated on the KFI:

"Standard Variable rate is 1.99% above the Bank of England base rate"

As a lender can change their SVR when they want whos to say they cant just change it to 4% above Bank of England base Rate.

It doesnt say anywhere that it tracks the BoE, only that it is currently 1.99 above it. I dont see that this is any different to how other lenders change the SVR.

pineman

pineman wrote: »

My first port of call was the FSA. They just refered me to the Ombudsman..so no luck there. They said they only deal with the lenders not the public. I guess it's the lenders that pay them.....

As a point of interest a friend of mine recently sold her house and asked her lender to move her mortgage to the new property she wants to buy. Her morgtgae documents clearly state that her mortgage in portable... HSBC (the lender) will not let her move it. On the grounds that a having a portable mortgage does not mean that it can be moved?? She has a tracker at a very very low rate so it would not be to HSBC advantage to allow her to move it. They rather she paid it off and started with a new mortgage at a higher rate. So it looks like the sale of her has will now not go through. Are all these bankers ( forgive me for mis spelling the word) Sharks!!!!

dunstonh

My first port of call was the FSA. They just refered me to the Ombudsman..so no luck there. They said they only deal with the lenders not the public. I guess it's the lenders that pay them.....

The FSA do not handle consumer complaints. That has never been their remit or responsibility. So, going to the FSA was always going to have that outcome.

I am struggling to see the issue here. You were quoted the Standard Variable Rate (SVR) at the time and the SVR can change. The SVR is not explicitly linked to the BOE rate. The clue is actually in the name; Standard VARIABLE rate. There is nothing in your text to say it is a tracker rate. If it did, you would have a case. However, it didnt.

As a point of interest a friend of mine recently sold her house and asked her lender to move her mortgage to the new property she wants to buy. Her morgtgae documents clearly state that her mortgage in portable... HSBC (the lender) will not let her move it. On the grounds that a having a portable mortgage does not mean that it can be moved?? She has a tracker at a very very low rate so it would not be to HSBC advantage to allow her to move it. They rather she paid it off and started with a new mortgage at a higher rate. So it looks like the sale of her has will now not go through. Are all these bankers ( forgive me for mis spelling the word)

Mortgage portability has never been a contractual event. Its a feature that lenders can choose to include or remove at a whim. Most do allow portability but link it to current lending criteria. Its that which catches most people out in recent times as they no longer meet current lending criteria (of those refused).

betmunch

pineman wrote: »

As a point of interest a friend of mine recently sold her house and asked her lender to move her mortgage to the new property she wants to buy. Her morgtgae documents clearly state that her mortgage in portable... HSBC (the lender) will not let her move it. On the grounds that a having a portable mortgage does not mean that it can be moved?? She has a tracker at a very very low rate so it would not be to HSBC advantage to allow her to move it. They rather she paid it off and started with a new mortgage at a higher rate. So it looks like the sale of her has will now not go through. Are all these bankers ( forgive me for mis spelling the word) Sharks!!!!

What was the reason they would not port it for?

There would have been a better reason than having a portable mortgage does not mean that it can be moved. This is exactly what it means, however a lot of people fail to understand that you still have to meet the lending criteria at the time of the porting application. And if they dont then they scream foul play!

pineman

Yes You are right but why mention the bank of England rate if it has nothing to do with the SVR. Only reason can be to misslead, otherwise they should have only stated the the current SVR is 2.49%.

dunstonh

pineman wrote: »

Yes You are right but why mention the bank of England rate if it has nothing to do with the SVR. Only reason can be to misslead, otherwise they should have only stated the the current SVR is 2.49%.

Probably as it gives you some sort of benchmark to where it sat at the time in relation to the BoE rate.

Historically, the SVR did tend to sort of follow the BoE rate. However, during the credit boom, many small and specialist lenders moved to LIBOR which would often differ quite a lot from the BoE rate.

pineman

Yes, you are right but why mention the bank of England rate if it has nothing to do with the SVR. Only reason can be to mislead, otherwise they should have only stated that the current SVR is 2.49%. By stating that the SVR is 1.99% above the Bank of England Rate it leads the Lay Person into thinking that is how the SVR is worked out and that it would vary according to the Bank of England rates. Not everyone knows what a Tracker Mortgage is and if it is not mentioned by the lender, ( they should have pointed out that the mortgage rate was not a tracker and that the Base rate has nothing to do with SVR ) the borrower is guided purely by what is supplied in the KFI.

pineman

Yes, you are right but why mention the bank of England rate if it has nothing to do with the SVR. Only reason can be to mislead, otherwise they should have only stated that the current SVR is 2.49%. By stating that the SVR is 1.99% above the Bank of England Rate it leads the Lay Person into thinking that is how the SVR is worked out and that it would vary according to the Bank of England rates. You are a financial adviser you understand the way the lenders work... what you and many others in the financial industry forget is that the rest of us do not know what you know and we rely on the information supplied to be accurate and clear. Not everyone knows what a Tracker Mortgage is and if it is not mentioned by the lender, ( they should have pointed out that the mortgage rate was not a tracker and that the Base rate has nothing to do with SVR ) the borrower is guided purely by what is supplied in the KFI.