Cannot take unaccrued holiday?

jc808

Hi - question

I am full time permanent employed
My contract (From my previous employer, protected by tupe) states broadly:

"You are given x amount of holiday per year. You accrue x amount of days per calendar month worked in the calendar year. If you take more than you have accrued at any given point in the year, and leave the company, you understand this difference will be recovered from you"

I have requested two seperate weeks off in January (Having extensive building work done)
I requested a third week off in february and was bounced, not for workload reasons but 'i had not accrued it' - i phoned my manager explaining my contract and he said 'but you may leave and there could be a shortfall in your final payment meaning you owe us'

really annoyed as i am a very flexible person there, and in any case by end of february (when i would have taken this holiday) i would have accrued 4 days worth of holiday, and the remaining 11 taken would have been covered by my notice period (4 weeks) ie any shortfall in accrued holiday would be taken from my final payment

My annual entitlement is 26 days

Does this sound right?

bbl_2

Tell him that you have no intention of leaving (if you dont) and understand that your aware that any final payments upon leaving would be deducted? Cant see any other reason not to allow it if you understand the terms (Which you do) and there are no other implications ie. other people on leave during same period....

paddedjohn

why are you only entitled to 26 days holiday? is this on top of bank holidays?
if your employer wants he can tell you when you must have your holidays as long as he gives the proper notice.

jc808

paddedjohn wrote: »

why are you only entitled to 26 days holiday? is this on top of bank holidays?
if your employer wants he can tell you when you must have your holidays as long as he gives the proper notice.

this is on top of bank holidays yes

not sure what you mean by employer telling me when to take holiday - my contract states i can take holiday when i want as long as

- it is booked sufficient time in advance (2 weeks usually)
- i have enough leave (though not necessarily accrued) left
- its within the calendar year (ie cannot be carried over into new year)
- is not more than 12 working days in length (ie 2 weeks 2 days)
- fits in with business requirements (ie noone else in the office off etc)

can you clarify? thankyou

jc808

bbl wrote: »

Tell him that you have no intention of leaving (if you dont) and understand that your aware that any final payments upon leaving would be deducted? Cant see any other reason not to allow it if you understand the terms (Which you do) and there are no other implications ie. other people on leave during same period....

site has the two other staff in during all these periods i am off and is not particularly busy (ie no large jobs expected etc, not to say any unexpected jobs will come down)

this is a 3 man site (including me) and i am the manager

paddedjohn

i think the sticking point is the fact that you wont have accrued enough by feb, you accrue 2.16 days a month (plus all your bank holidays) and you are taking 10 off in jan, thats already about 7.8 more than you have earned.
from your employers point of view, what if you just left one day without working any notice?

bbl_2

jc808 wrote: »

site has the two other staff in during all these periods i am off and is not particularly busy (ie no large jobs expected etc, not to say any unexpected jobs will come down)

this is a 3 man site (including me) and i am the manager

Raise all previous points mentioned in contract, state possible work loads during the period, might come round to the fact that it is not going to inconvenience them in any way?

jc808

paddedjohn wrote: »

i think the sticking point is the fact that you wont have accrued enough by feb, you accrue 2.16 days a month (plus all your bank holidays) and you are taking 10 off in jan, thats already about 7.8 more than you have earned.
from your employers point of view, what if you just left one day without working any notice?

suppose thats a good point - been working there 11 years though!!

im not sure if my salary is in arrears - i may take this up with hr, get their thoughts

frustratingly, loads of people in this company would just pull a sickie = free holiday
doesnt pay to be honest, i suppose....

DVardysShadow

jc808 wrote: »

suppose thats a good point - been working there 11 years though!!

im not sure if my salary is in arrears - i may take this up with hr, get their thoughts

frustratingly, loads of people in this company would just pull a sickie = free holiday
doesnt pay to be honest, i suppose....

Then your boss is totally out of order to refuse you leave on the grounds stated. It is not as if you are a new starter. In fact, I would say on his line of argument, I would say he is not competent to supervise or manage the company cat.

You don't tell us about the size of your company, but I would be thinking of telling him I would be going above his head and that I found his approach to this unfounded in terms of employment law, wrong in terms of the contract and insulting in terms of your length of service.

jc808

DVardysShadow wrote: »

Then your boss is totally out of order to refuse you leave on the grounds stated. It is not as if you are a new starter. In fact, I would say on his line of argument, I would say he is not competent to supervise or manage the company cat.

You don't tell us about the size of your company, but I would be thinking of telling him I would be going above his head and that I found his approach to this unfounded in terms of employment law, wrong in terms of the contract and insulting in terms of your length of service.

wont go in all guns blazing but i will clarify my position with hr, and speak to him again

this is a very large worldwide japanese technology company with an outsourced facilities management arm in the uk (among other countries) at which i am based at a client site

LittleVoice

paddedjohn wrote: »

why are you only entitled to 26 days holiday? is this on top of bank holidays?
if your employer wants he can tell you when you must have your holidays as long as he gives the proper notice.

jc808 you asked what the bold text meant

It is that the working time regulations allow the employer to say when you take holidays as long as they give you at least twice as much notice of the holiday as the holiday will last (so two weeks' notice of a one-week holiday).

You could say they are already doing that in part by saying that the bank holidays are taken as holiday from your entitlement (which otherwise would be higher than 26 days).

Some employers (particularly in manufacturing) will say when summer and Christmas holidays are taken so that they can close the production line for everyone.