Clearing Half of a Joint Debt

NWMazda

Hi,

Hoping someone may be able to offer me some good advice about an account I have with a collection company called DLC.

To cut a long story short, myself and my ex partner ran up debt a good few years back and DLC bought this debt from Barclays and took over the account. This is a joint debt in both of our names. It was for random things like a car, it was not credit card related.

We were both silly and buried our heads in the same until eventually, five years ago I spoke with DLC and we met a payment agreement. The balance on the account originally was just over £20,500 with interest frozen. DLC were very reasonable and allowed me to pay a low payment and I've done so for the past five years without ever missing a payment, so all was well.

Now in August, I decided to make an attempt to try and rebuild my credit rating and applied for a credit card and was successful. I have no intention of running up more debt I'm past that now, just to pay for petrol here and there and attempt to get the rating up as I say. My girlfriend went and got breast cancer so the credit card as also at attempt at some sort of backup for when she couldn't work. Now last week, DLC have written to me saying they have new information about my financial situation and need me to contact them urgently. I ignored it, they wrote again and began ringing my phone off the wall night and day.

So it turns out, they'd looked at my credit file and saw that I'd gotten a credit card. This prompted them to want to protect their money and they started banding round a few comments like CCJ and house and clearing the balance etc.

It's worth noting at this point that the joint debtor has never paid a penny on this debt and has no intention of ever doing so. I've supplied them with their correct address on many occasions and still, the balance only ever goes down by what I pay which is actually quite painful to me as you can imagine. They have me, they don't bother with persuing her.

So, I contacted DLC and they said we'd need to do a full income/expenditure thing again and go from there. Can they actually start making these threats to me when I've paid the account perfectly for five years? Do I have any rights here or can they do what they want?

The lady I was dealing with today ended up being on other calls so I have to speak to her tomorrow to see what her manager makes of my finances and what is to happen from here.

One option I did put to them was to obtain a settlement figure and buy my way out of this ONLY if the joint debtor was to remain solely responsible for the remmaining monies. She could not comment on this as she said a settlment figure could only be made possible depending on what her manager thinks of my figures. I was very clear in saying to her that I would only pay a settlement figure IF the remaining debt remaining in the joint debtors name, I could not stomach clearing this for her aswell. The lady on the phone understood what I said and did not make any suggestion that this was an imnpossible thing to do.

If they half the original balance and take off what I have paid already to make it fair, I think a full balance pay off for me only is £8,000. What is a reasonable settlement discount off £8,000? One reason they might not be happy about a settlement figure for me only is because they know they won't get money from the other party, they basically said this on the phone. Has anyone ever had a debt officially halved when a joint debtor was involved?

It seems really unfair to me that after paying this for five years, the stress of it all is back whilst they leave the joint debtor along to merrily crack on with her life, it's just wrong.

I have no idea what they are going to ask of me tomorrow and I'm worried they are going to try and start putting securities against our house to protect this debt all because I applied for a stupid credit card.

Any advice would be appreciated ahead of this call at 1pm tomorrow afternoon, especially if anyone knows for sure whether they would let me buy my way out of this and still leave the rest active for the joint debtor.

Many thanks,
Steve

NorthernLas

You need to give more information as to what sort of debt DLC bought ...

You've said it wasn't a credit card?
Was it a loan?
Was it an overdraft?
Did you get a default on the account?
Have you had statements from DLC, so you know the debt is reducing?

If it was a joint account then I would think that you are jointly and severably liable for the full amount. So if one of you does not pay, then they can get the full amount from the other.

As to what DLC can do ... assuming that the account was in default when they bought it, they cannot add another one.

Others will be along with opinions soon.

NWMazda

Thanks for your reply, I will try and elaborate on the debt. We used to have a few loans and probably an overdraft and a loan for a car. It was all bit messy and payments were high so we took out a joint consolidation loan to pay everything off and get it into one with Barclays. We screwed up with this too and yes it went into default and was eventually bought by DLC.

I have no idea what DLC are going to try and ask from us as monthly payments. Our other worry is that they are going to start asking for an unreasonable figure and then threatening us with a charge against our house.

I have a family member who has offered to loan me money to pay this off but due to the huge ill feeling in our family about my ex partner, everyone is hugely keen that our money does not clear this debt for her also. If DLC would allow me to buy myself out of this debt, would it be unreasonable to ask for a settlement discount off that amount? Reading around the internet, many people get very good settlement discounts.

I would hope that with me off the account, they could then actively pursue my ex partner for the balance.

barbiedoll

I'm almost certain that they will not "split" the debt, like all joint financial products, each debtor is liable for the whole amount, how you split your finances is up to you. You are both liable for the debt so if one of you can't/won't pay, the other is liable for the whole amount.

It may be worth looking at this from another angle. Have you requested a CCA? (consumer credit agreement) It may be that they will not be able to locate one after this length of time and without one, they cannot get a CCJ, charging order or anything else. You wouldn't even have to pay if you didn't want to although that is obviously a matter for your own conscience. If the loan was taken out before 2007, there is a chance that any original CCA would be invalid in the eyes of the law, many agreements drawn up before then did not have the correct terms on the contracts. Again, if the CCA is invalid the DCA would not be able to go to court to enforce the debt. If either of these cases apply to you, it would be much easier to offer a very low Full and Final settlement figure as the DCA would prefer to collect even a small amount towards the debt rather than nothing at all. A good place to start is this thread...

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/2532927

There are template letters for you to request the CCA, as a starting point.

I would forget about trying to pay only your "half" of this debt, as far as the DCA is concerned, you are the only one willing to pay anything so you are the one that they are going to chase. You sometimes have to fight fire with fire so prepare for a battle. Do not call them, send all letters by recorded delivery and keep copies of every bit of correspondance. Good luck, let us know how you get on.

NWMazda

Many thanks for your reply there.

When you say ask for the CCA, do you mean the original CCA that was done with Barclays and that therefore would have been passed on to DLC?

I really want to get this solved without any mess and court action. If I ask for the CCA and they can provide it, will that not just make them very annoyed and start to play much harder tactics?

I appreciate what you are saying about not calling DLC. My worry though is that because they are insisting this happens, my not calling them will inspire them to begin much harder tactics also.

Would it not be wise to call them tomorrow as required and just at least hear out what they are going to ask from me? I'm sure they will be demanding results from this call rather than letting me get away to 'think about it'.

So, is the CCA request a risk? If they don't have it, would they just admit to that? And I assume they'd still never leave me alone and I'd need to seek legal assistance? If they do have it, I'm instantly in their bad books?

NWMazda

Does anone think this is a good plan of action for my case:

1. Call DLC as required tomorrow and hear what they expect of me but agree to nothing. If the monthly amount they require from me is achieveable, ask for the offer in writing.

2. Once the offer in writing comes through, then request the CCA before continuing.

niccatw

If they do have the CCA then yes, they are likely to act upon it. But if they had it, they probably would have acted on it before now.

Either way, they are likely to persue you for as much as they think they can possibly get out of you.

That being the case, I personally wouldn't speak to them on the phone and would do it all through written correspondence as previous posters have suggested. And state that you want all future commuincation in written format.

You and your girlfriend have enough to deal with without having to sort stuff out with a DCA on the phone all the time.

Good luck

NorthernLas

Have you given DLC an income and expenditure sheet? They can ask for this, but you do not have to provide it to them.

Personally, I would not call DLC. If they phone you, I would tell them that you are taking financial advice on your debt.

They may phone you more but they are unlikely to do anything more than this and you can write to them and ask them to correspond in writing only.

Are you still paying DLC each month? If you are then requesting your CCA is unlikely to upset them, it costs £1 and you use a standard letter. Although there are people on here who can help with UE, the best place to go is https://www.all-about-debt.co.uk as the template letters are up to date and you will get good advice as to whether your agreement is enforceable or not.

NWMazda

Yes I still pay DLC monthly, never missed a payment in five years. I'm sure what they want from me, that's the thing stressing me out. They've not asked for more money, just about how they want to protect their debt. I'm worried that if I don't call, they'll attempt to do something with our house which I need to avoid. I guess they have acted on the CCA because they chased me five years ago to start paying it. I shall check out the other forum and ask for a CCA. Thanks for all help

NWMazda

I've just called them up because I promised I would and I now feel physically sick.

They offered a 10% reduction on the 18,xxx balance and would only accept in the region of 16k to clear the balance, because I am a home owner.

They want to raise my payments from £28pm to £312pm even though they see my finances don't support this in any way. Their intention is to take a CCJ against me and secure against my house even though I've never missed a payment.

They are writing to me to confirm this.

I offered them 7k as a settlement figure, they flatly turned me down but asked for it as a lump payment off the balance!!

My girlfriend is going to have a breakdown when she hears this. This is the worst thing ever.

ItMightBeUsefulOneDay

NWMazda wrote: »

I've just called them up because I promised I would and I now feel physically sick.
<lots of cutting>
This is the worst thing ever.

Stop thinking of these people as your friends, as people you want to be nice to or even treat fairly. They are debt collectors and you need to wake up and smell the coffee on this one. These people are trained in scaring people into paying. They bleed people dry for as much as they can then spit out the husk. They daily screw people over, promise all kinds of discounts and then deny it all blind.

Never. Ever. Ever phone up a DCA. It ALWAYS ends in tears.

They now know you have £7k lying around which (given they will have bought the debt for peanuts) will be a nice little earner if they can scare you into paying it. Then they can hound you for more until they bleed you dry. The rest will be sold on (for more pennies in the pound) to the next DCA who will start the process all over again.

It is a joint debt and so you are FULLY LIABLE for the WHOLE amount. This isn't going to change so be prepared to clear it on your own. The DCAs will go after the easiest target which in this case is you I'm afraid.

Ok. Now let's start some damage limitation and get the situation under your control rather than theirs.

Firstly, don't panic or stress (easier said than done) - these people feed on fear because they know it will make you panic and pay something. You need to stay informed, clear headed and resolute in your determination to sort this out on YOUR terms, not theirs.

Second you'll need to come to an arrangement to pay off this debt - they can't have what you haven't got so don't worry if you can only afford £3.12 per month. Go to one of the FREE debt charities or your local CAB to discuss and arrange this.