"non-verified loans made up 43% of all home loans granted in first 3 months of 2010"

carolt

Really2 wrote: »

Here you go,
http://www.newstatesman.com/economy/2010/07/certification-mortgages-self
We discussed on the other thread yesterday, you even commented on it! You cant say you dont remember 2 hours earlier

So says the new Statesman.

Not clear why you think the New Statesman is a more reliable source than the BBC?

The BBC seems pretty clear and unequivocal in its statement of the facts.

Really2

carolt wrote: »

So says the new Statesman.

Not clear why you think the New Statesman is a more reliable source than the BBC?

The BBC seems pretty clear and unequivocal in its statement of the facts.the BBC are quoting the CML

They quote the FSA not the CML, it is the CML who are trying to stop these getting banned.

So if they make out more are used they can use it as leaverage.

The FSA want them banned, I would go with the one without the VI but you go for the CML if you like.

carolt

Sorry, are you seriously suggesting the FSA just made up the 43% figure?

My title is correct - your post is irrelevant to the facts.

Really2

carolt wrote: »

Sorry, are you seriously suggesting the FSA just made up the 43% figure?
err no I am saying the quote you are using has been stretched by the CML by removing the FROM 2007 bit.
My title is correct - your post is irrelevant to the facts.

You are not reading carol. You are quoting the CML not me, I agree with the FSA which is nearly half of mortgages from 2007-2010.

The FSA said nearly 50% of all mortages from 2007-2010 were self cert.

The CML changed that to 43% were in 2010.

Have a read through Carol.

You have posted no facts carol , just a CML quote?

carolt

Really2 wrote: »

You are not reading carol. You are quoting the CML not me, I agree with the FSA which is nearly half of mortgages from 2007-2010.

The FSA said nearly 50% of all mortages from 2007-2010 were self cert.

The CML changed that to 43% were in 2010.

Have a read through Carol.

You have posted no facts carol , just a CML quote?

No YOU are not reading, Really.

Please actually bother to click on the OP.

This is exactly what it says (no changes made):

"The FSA is worried that despite the banking crisis and economic downturn, and the current severe rationing of mortgages, too many people are still being given home loans even though they cannot show that they can afford them.

In July it pointed out that so-called non-verified loans still made up 43% of all home loans granted in the first three months of 2010."

Really2

carolt wrote: »

No YOU are not reading, Really.

Please actually bother to click on the OP.

This is exactly what it says (no changes made):

"The FSA is worried that despite the banking crisis and economic downturn, and the current severe rationing of mortgages, too many people are still being given home loans even though they cannot show that they can afford them.

In July it pointed out that so-called non-verified loans still made up 43% of all home loans granted in the first three months of 2010."

My quote is the July FSA quote!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
http://www.newstatesman.com/economy/2010/07/certification-mortgages-self

Published 14 July 2010

Lesley Titcomb, the FSA director for the mortgage market, said this was a step toward building a strong framework to protect mortgage customers and to make sure that the "problems of the past do not happen again, particularly as the mortgage market recovers."

Self-certification mortgages accounted for almost half of all new mortgages advanced between 2007 and the first quarter of 2010, according to the FSA.

You are hard work Carol, I tend to agree with the article released in July not the poorly quoted one in sept!!!!!

blueboy43

http://www.fsa.gov.uk/pubs/cp/cp10_16.pdf

This I believe is the source document.

Amazingly it seems Q1 2010 had 43% of mortgages "income not verified" - Exhibit 2.4 page 18.

However, I would infer from figure 2.5 and the section on fast tracking, that the majority of these are with low Loan to Value mortgages, perhaps people switching lender who have say 70-80% equity. I will be switching in similar circumstances in the next few months, so we shall see.

Looks like Carol was right on the facts of the matter.

*sits back to watch the inevitable barney*

Really2

And so was I it was far higher in 2007 than now? (but you were right carol I believed it was a misquote).
http://www.fsa.gov.uk/pubs/cp/cp10_16.pdf

But nice to see these are all virtualy 0% risk loans now to the banks due to the LTV requirements.:beer:

Not quiet as bad news as some had hoped.:D

Thrugelmir

blueboy43 wrote: »

http://www.fsa.gov.uk/pubs/cp/cp10_16.pdf

This I believe is the source document.

Amazingly it seems Q1 2010 had 43% of mortgages "income not verified" - Exhibit 2.4 page 18.

However, I would infer from figure 2.5 and the section on fast tracking, that the majority of these are with low Loan to Value mortgages, perhaps people switching lender who have say 70-80% equity. I will be switching in similar circumstances in the next few months, so we shall see.

Looks like Carol was right on the facts of the matter.

*sits back to watch the inevitable barney*

Thanks for digging the report up.

As ususual the media has more than likely ramped up on a single fact. Without investigating and comparing like for like. The mortgage market has changed significantly since 2007. The demised lenders account for the worst lending culprits.

In the FSA report it says

To ensure that lenders base this assessment on accurate information, we propose that lenders must verify income for all mortgage applications. This proposal effectively bans self-certification and fast-track mortgages where income is not
verified. We are not proposing to be prescriptive about the type of evidence that lenders can use to verify income, but the evidence must be from a source independent of the consumer and should be sufficient to enable the lender to assess the risks posed by the consumer’s individual circumstances

As mortgages for the self employed are difficult to come by. I assume this to refer to the lack of obtaining evidence of income from those in employment. Easy enough to have some payslips made up. In days gone by lenders would write to employers for confirmation of salary and employment terms etc.

Self certification today isn't what is was a few years back.

blueboy43

Really2 wrote: »

And so was I it was far higher in 2007 than now? (but you were right carol I believed it was a misquote).
http://www.fsa.gov.uk/pubs/cp/cp10_16.pdf

But nice to see these are all virtualy 0% risk loans now to the banks due to the LTV requirements.:beer:

Not quiet as bad news as some had hoped.:D

The fact that close to 20% of mortgages with less than 10% deposit had no income verification in 2007 is staggering.