no CCA, no debt

forumman_2

I recently requested a cca from eggs debt collector and quick as a flash they've said that they are no longer dealing with it. I am now going to repeat the request with EGG themselves. The question is, if egg fail to provide within 12days is the debt null and void?

file_wizzard

No, the creditor will have 12 days to respond to your initial CCA request, and if a properly executed CCA agreement is not provided within 28 days from the date of the original request then the creditor will be unable to enforce the debt via the CCA until such time as a correctly executed CCA is provided.

However if an account has been opened, payments made, and it is reasonably presumed that you are the account holder then this would constitute a contract within the terms of "a simple form of contract" and they can technically pursue you through the courts on this basis. (although it is unlikely)

Is the debt is dispute? , or are you suggesting it was fraudulently obtained by a 3rd party?

sgx.saint

So in theory someone could ask say a company, who knowingly they owe money too for a copy of their CCA?

If that company does not supply the CCA within 28 days then legally they cannot enforce the debt? ... Apart from the above mentioned "simple form of contract"?

Seems a little silly if you ask me. Knowing that a lot of companies have back logs of requests may fail to provide within that time.

A loophole that some may try and exploit?

file_wizzard

sgx.saint wrote:

So in theory someone could ask say a company, who knowingly they owe money too for a copy of their CCA?

If that company does not supply the CCA within 28 days then legally they cannot enforce the debt? ... Apart from the above mentioned "simple form of contract"?

Seems a little silly if you ask me. Knowing that a lot of companies have back logs of requests may fail to provide within that time.

A loophole that some may try and exploit?

Indeed, however the debt would still be enforceable if the CCA was found after the 28 Days, all it means is that the creditor would be unable to take any further recovery action until the correct documentation was provided, the debt is not "null & void" after the 28 days, just unenforceable until such time as the correct documentation is provided.

sgx.saint

Indeed, however the debt would still be enforceable if the CCA was found after the 28 Days, all it means is that the creditor would be unable to take any further recovery action until the correct documentation was provided, the debt is not "null & void" after the 28 days, just unenforceable until such time as the correct documentation is provided.

Ah, thanks for clearing that up. That makes more sense

file_wizzard

Also just to clarify the “simple form of contact argument”

If A agreed to lend B £500 on the condition the B repaid it 1 month later, and then B failed to repay this, A would have cause to apply to the court for an order for B to repay the amount owed under a simple form of contract (this can be verbal and there is no requirement for a signed written agreement) all A would need to do is demonstrate to the court that on the balance of probability that the transaction / agrement had taken place and that B had failed to honor it.

B would then have 2 options;

1) Admit to the court that the money was owed and repay it.
2) Lie to the court and risk purging His / Herself ( not a very clever idea as you can imagine!)

However, when it comes to an agreement where it was the intention of both party’s that this should be governed by a CCA agreement then the court would have little sympathy with the creditor if they had failed to correctly execute the agreement, and had then tried to use the court to enforce the contract argument.

The court would not see that it should become involved because of the Creditors mistake.

The home shopping catalogues are prime examples of this as they very rarely ensure that a correctly executed CCA agreement is in place, and when the debtor defaults they make all sorts of silly threats about their ability to recover.

sgx.saint

In my case for example. I am currently on a DMP (self managed) and have been for many months now.

I do not speak orally to my creditors (I refuse to provide my phone number) and I deal with them on a written basis only. I have found MSE extremely useful in knowing more about my rights and my letters to my creditors have demonstrated this.

Over half of my creditors are now DCA's as my debts have been passed on. When my debt has been passed on, after reading some threads on MSE and on the CAG forum, they recommend sending a basic CCA letter asking to prove the debt is yours? .... Is this a wise idea? I see no benefit to it other than a delay in you having to make repayment or a 1 in a million chance they have lost the CCA.

Emmzi

Your odds are much better than 1 in a million. The record keeping, especially on older debts, can be appalling.

But, basically, I agree with you.

PII_XTV

Hi,

Just found this forum and it is an excellent source of info.

My first post is, what is a CCA...? Are these something you have with credit cards and loans etc...?

file_wizzard

PII_XTV wrote:

Hi,

Just found this forum and it is an excellent source of info.

My first post is, what is a CCA...? Are these something you have with credit cards and loans etc...?

It's an Abreviation for the Consumer Credit Act, most finance agrements in the U.K are completed with this as their guidance.

You will find lots on here, few to get you started.

CCA = Consumer Credit Act
DPA = Data Protection Act
SOA = Statement Of Affairs (list of all your monthly incoming and outgoings)

there are lots more, im sure you will pick them all up !