Cambridge graduate can't get a job.

bristol_pilot

Owain_Moneysaver wrote: »

That means that for work in natural sciences, your degree is out of date, and for anything else it's irrelevant. So wake up to the fact that graduates are now working for £12k p.a. and grateful for it.

Not many Cambridge science graduates with 20+ years relevant experience are working for £12k. There are actually jobs around, particularly in the applied physical sciences, for experienced people - I have enough trouble trying to recruit some! There is, I suspect, more to the OP's situation than he/she has yet revealed on this forum.

Emmzi

Chomeur wrote: »

I think my real issue is that I sense more than a bit of hypocrisy from employers.

You say "my problem" and immediately you make it about them.

That is your problem.

Until you realise it must be something about you, you will not change, and keeping doing the same thing and expecting different results. Um... I am sure someone of your intelligence realises what that is.

RobertoMoir

Chomeur wrote: »

I think my real issue is that I sense more than a bit of hypocrisy from employers. They are always talking about the "soft skills" that Lavendyr mentions ("teamwork, initiative, organisational skills, determination and so on"). But in the jobs I've had I've encountered colleagues who were more obdurate, impractical, lazy, small-minded and inarticulate than I could ever have imagined. And that's the frustration, that people like this get good jobs and I can't.

Perhaps there's a reason for that. Instead of getting frustrated why not consider why they get jobs and you don't, then take steps to fix that.

Of course no doubt I'm going to be accused again of considering myself superior, and I was expecting that from my first post too. But I would ask anyone who accuses me of that, whether, assuming my perceptions were true, would you ever allow anyone to express them? Or would you just refuse to acknowledge that such a situation could ever exist?

The fact that you're asking for help and then playing games with the people trying to give you it speaks volumes. Not good ones either I'm afraid.

An employer in an interview is a person trying to solve a problem. That's somewhat obvious, of course, but people don't seem to actually think about how to apply that theory when applying for a job, you have to understand the problems of the person interviewing you then you have to help them understand why you are the solution to those problems.

If an employer can sense that you're sitting there 'sensing hypocrisy' - and people are quite perceptive about attitudes and 'vibe' from others even if they can't put their finger on it when asked why afterwards - then they will probably consider that candidate likely to add to their list of problems rather than reduce it.

David_Brent

cheesypop wrote: »

Hi all,

I don't usually post my opinions on these boards, but you have touched on a subject I feel strongly about.

First all I want it to be clear from the start that I don't believe that further education is right for everyone and people don't deserve jobs based purely on having a degree. I also believe that recently degrees have become relatively worthless because so many people have them.

What I do object to is people saying that standards at all universities are the same and that gaining a 2.1 at one university is the same as gaining one at another. This is simply not the case. There are no common standards, or rules set out by an educational authority setting a university syllabus.

I studied maths at a redbrick university and need an A grade at A-level in maths and further maths to win a place. I found the course extremely challenging. I have a friend who also studied maths at a university a lot lower down the league tables. He got a C at A-level maths and didn't study further maths.

He came out with a higher degree classification than me, however comparing our course notes it turned out that material he covered in his final year we covered in our first. There is no question that my degree was harder, even my friend admits this and constantly jokes with me that he turned out to be the smart one as he picked the university that was going to get him the best grade.

This is certainly an issue that the government needs to sort out.

I'm sorry for the rant, and realise this doesn't help the OP however it does makes me feel a little better

Sorry but you comparing your 'notes' with someone else does not warrent that your degree was any where nearer harder than anyone elses thats total rubbish. You prove to me that the degrees at 'red brick universities as you like to call them' are any harder than any where else - do you have any studies or statistics to prove this?

laurel7172

Unfortunately, even allowing for the fact that it's hard to tell online, you do come across as, possibly, a little bit arrogant. One of the things you do realise as you mature is that certificates don't count for a great deal in the real world. I have drawers full of them-by your (apparent) standards I am brighter and better qualified than most of the people I work with. And, actually, my colleagues do know it, but it's just my contribution to the team. J is artistic, K is experienced and empathic, Laurel is clever...we all respect and learn from each other.

As a recent graduate, no matter how book-smart you are, you have, sorry, far more to learn from your putative colleagues than to offer. If you are coming across as believing anything else, you aren't going to be an attractive employment prospect. And if you've had negative personal feedback that often, it might be time to start paying attention.

poet123

Actually, it is possible to make a judgement on the difficulty level of a given degree course based on an assessment of module content, qualifications required to begin study, and other factors.

It is an accepted fact that course difficulty, and therefore, ultimately, the quality of the degree, varies from University to Unversity. For this reason, in law for example, many top firms will only accept applicants from Russell Group Universities.

T800

I think you should emigrate to a country where your degree will be highly sought after. Its all about supply and demand, and in the UK, we have high supply of graduates, low demand of jobs.

SarEl

bristol_pilot wrote: »

Not many Cambridge science graduates with 20+ years relevant experience are working for £12k. There are actually jobs around, particularly in the applied physical sciences, for experienced people - I have enough trouble trying to recruit some! There is, I suspect, more to the OP's situation than he/she has yet revealed on this forum.

Hear, hear. The OP is giving information in dribs and drabs, without context or accuracy. "Ignite blue touch paper and stand back..."? Like another poster here, I noticed that by far the majority of his previous posts have been about gambling (and wondered how he afforded such a habit on a student income - until he casually mentioned he had been working 20 years). Perhaps it's a bet as to how many posts he can attract to a totally irrelevant thread?

Chomeur

SarEl wrote: »

Hear, hear. The OP is giving information in dribs and drabs, without context or accuracy. "Ignite blue touch paper and stand back..."? Like another poster here, I noticed that by far the majority of his previous posts have been about gambling (and wondered how he afforded such a habit on a student income - until he casually mentioned he had been working 20 years). Perhaps it's a bet as to how many posts he can attract to a totally irrelevant thread?

Hey, I don't want to give a full summary of my career over the last 20 years. (a) there isn't time and (b) I would prefer not to give enough away to be identified on here, because if I'm anonymous I can be much more open in what I say.

I never said that I was a recent graduate. On graduating I had serious difficulties in getting employment, and the situation at the moment is that I can't get a job. That may well be due to the current economic situation, although friends of mine do seem to be getting jobs at the moment without that much difficulty. Some of them have expressed surprise that I can't get a job. One asked me the other day if I was really trying. I am. I feel very frustrated by some of the reasons I've been turned down for jobs in the past, which I can't but feel have been pretexts made because employers don't want to employ someone too bright. I know that some posters have said that loads of people have exam results like mine so I shouldn't take that view, but I find that strange - at my school I was the only person to get the A and S level results that I got, so where all these people come from I don't know.

I won't mention to my friends anything about my feelings that employers are disingenuous. I'll say that I posted on a discussion forum online and the conclusions were that maybe I'm arrogant and maybe I'm a victim of inverse snobbery from some interviewers. I'll see what they say.

Emmzi

Chomeur wrote: »

I'll say that I posted on a discussion forum online and the conclusions were that maybe I'm arrogant and maybe I'm a victim of inverse snobbery from some interviewers. I'll see what they say.

1. your friends will not give you an honest opinion if they think it may hurt your feelings

2. and there are more than 2 reasons you may not be getting a job so an either/or option may not be the best one

I would see if you can do a mock interview somehow, video yourself, and play yourself back and see how you come over. Not sure how tho! Might be worth paying an outplacement specialist for that as an investment in your future.

And, I would pay very close attention to the multiple suggestions of volunteering. It gives you far more to talk about in interview than matched betting....

If you are serious about finding work, this will do you more good than all the navel gazing with your mates in the universe...