Young Couple with no income and small debt

msmicawber

Dear Ixworth,

I still think the best people to give practical advice on bankruptcy, etc. are the CCCS or Paypal.

Best wishes.

linniestorm

ixworth wrote:

btw: It's evident that you do need to be careful when taking and giving advice on here. Bailiffs can definitely visit and remove goods for debts that aren't secured. My son has a CCJ against him that demanded immediate repayment of over £1000; as he hasn't paid this there could definitely be a visit and removal of goods.

They could indeed come round, but they can't force their way into your son's property, so if he doesn't let them in they can't take anything! I'd suggest until he's talked to Payplan or the CCCS (they're the free companies by the way, remind him not to go with any of the ones advertising on telly, they charge!) he doesn't open the door to them, whatever they say, he's not obliged to, its his property!

I think its definitely a good idea to talk to the experts (CCCS or Payplan) before going straight into bankruptcy. They can look at his incomings, outgoings etc and suggest which way might be best, IVA, DMP or Bankruptcy (which as you mentioned, has its reprecussions.)

They have websites as well if he/you want to check them out first, but I believe all their appointments are only around an hour, and on the phone, so pretty easy to manage.
http://www.cccs.co.uk/
http://www.payplan.com/

rchddap1

I would suggest you take a look at the Old Style forums for that grocery budget. £300 a month for 2 people and a baby is very high. We're currently 2 people (baby is on the way) and am spending on average around £80 per month, but budget £100.

I intend to make as much baby food as possible, am going to give breastfeeding a go...not too sure about re-useable nappies at the moment, but might be convinced further down the line.

Mirtos

ixworth wrote:

I'm impressed btw by the report that you can live on £120/month for food/groceries. Even if that figure is meant to include food only that works out at a little under £28/week for two adults. £4/day for breakfast, lunch and dinner for two doesn't seem a lot but I suppose sausage/mash, spam+chips, spag bol etc. can all be made for a couple of quid or so, and lunches of omelettes, sandwiches, beans on toast etc. aren't going to come to much more than a pound or so. Just goes to show how much slack there probably is in the normal weekly shop; I feel guilty now thinking about how much I spend. Of course cleaning materials, things for the baby etc. will swell this bill but perhaps I'll take my son shopping with me and diplomatically educate him.

Hi there and welcome :wave: I just wanted to say that £120/month doesn't mean spam and chips. There are 2 greedy adults in our household, and I entertain at home at least once a week for work, so that adds about 6 extra adult meals a month. We spend about £90 on a giant tesco shop every 4-6 weeks, and then £20 extra on fresh fruit and veg from the market as and when we need it. It works out at £120 or less a month, and to be frank, we eat like kings. We eat EVERYTHING home made, and we both work full time (in fact, I have 2 jobs plus part time tutoring and am rushed off my feet!), so it doesn't take forever to do. As has already been said - check out the Old Style moneysaving boards for pointers. We do a monthly meal plan before each tesco shop, so we dont buy stuff we dont need or are going to waste. we eat stuff like risotto, lasagne, shepherds pie, grilled meats and salad, chilli, stirfrys, currys, stews, soups (lentil tomato), baked vegetables, roast dinners, sweet and savoury pies, quiche, crusty bread, cakes, ice cream, yoghurt, biscuits, and a glass of wine with most evening meals! ALL HOME MADE. At £300 a month, that means that compared to our budget, your son is spending £180 extra - more than is necessary for the baby I think. I also thought about the £40 petrol - if your son and his girlfriend are both unemployed, where are they driving to other than interviews/ the job centre / the supermarket? For just this, £40 a month seems high, but I could be wrong if it's miles and miles to the Job centre. That's all the practical advice I can give in terms of saving money NOW. I think CCCs or Payplan are the best bet - and they are free, so what have you got to lose?!

Murtle

For advice on bankruptcy - you say mortgage/rent in the outgoings. This will be affected by bankruptcy. If it is only rent, then the possibility of a mortgage will be affected by banruptcy for 6(?) years to come. For £6,000 they need to decide if it is worth it it? They will also be restricted on credit cards, current accounts and direct debit cards. There are some career paths which he may need to disclose this to, ie working in banks etc.The advise was fine on the baliffs as you don't HAVE to allow them in. It's only when they are in can goods be taken, unless it's a car that has been paid for and then I believe they can take this if it's parked on public land.Mx x

woohoo_postingid

They need to look at their debts in the long term rather than just 'How much per month' they are paying. How much on each debt, interest rates etc.
They also need targets, aim to pay off XX debt by XX date and so on. The feeling they will have when they pay off a debt is fantastic and can only encourage them.

Food has already been mentioned so no further comment there.

The car may be 'essential' but is the petrol that is spent on it 'essential'?
Could your son's partner have the insurance in her name (if she can drive) as this may be cheaper.

Finally, which no-one seems to have mentioned yet - Working! Is there a reason why your son doesn't work? They can still earn money and be able to claim some benefits plus it can open up other doors for them.

ixworth

I'm sorry but I'm feeling a little defensive on my son's behalf here...

Petrol: £40 / month equates to about 60 miles a week which as our village is 10 miles from the nearest town equates to less than 1 trip to town every other day. Some of the job interviews are in Ipswich which is 25 miles away. I think, if anything, I've underestimated the petrol spend. Oh and we forgot car tax in the SOA which adds another £160 or so but I'll probably end up paying that.

Working: My son himself (through me) mentioned working in our earlier post. He has applied for many jobs but has no qualifications and can't get any job involving driving because of the DD on his licence. All of the jobs he has chased up offer minimum wage (just over £5/hour) and he is worried that taking such a job will leave him worse off financially because of the expenses involved with going to work (travel/food etc.).

Bailiffs: I know what the law says about bailiffs rights but I have also read tales of bailiffs pushing past women as they put babies into pushchairs, of pushing past people as they open the door and then saying they were invited in, of lying about who they are and then denying it afterwads, of banging loudly on doors for hours on end. We expect bailiffs to arrive and know what to expect. The original question was intended to seek information about the sort of protection against bailiffs bankruptcy would afford.

Food/Groceries: We did point out in our earlier reply that we though there was some slack in this budget and that it did include items strictly speaking not food/grocery-related. I expect this figure to come down to £200/month but they have a new baby which is undoubtedly going to throw some more financial spanners in the works that they haven't factored into the equations.

They have been trying to pay off their debts but won't be able to while surviving on benefits. The benefits system just about enables you to get by, it doesn't give you the means to pay existing debts on top of that especially if the creditors insist they want over £100 / month between them and won't budge.

ixworth

OK, back to the main thrust of the original post.

What will bankruptcy mean to my son and his partner?

Will they have a completely clean slate?
Will they be able to call the police if bailiffs try and enter their property?
Will they lose any of the few posessions that they have?


Given the fact that even if he had no car and could find public transport, and if they were to reduce their spend to £200 / month on food/groceries/baby bits as has been suggested is possible. They still won't have enough to pay towards outstanding debt at current levels and the creditors don't seem to be willing to freeze interest, accept small repayments, or offer any other way forward.

They're going to see the CAB's debt expert tomorrow; hopefully they'll get some straightforward advice from him/her.

If anyone has advice or experience of a situation similar to my son's then we'd appreciate it before they meet eh CAB.

Please no more criticism of the fact that they have a car and put petrol in it, nor advice that he should get a job (unless you can provide info about how this affects bankruptcy or know of any well-paid, legal, regular jobs for the inexperienced and unqualified).

msmicawber

Dear Ixworth,

No one's trying to criticise - they're just asking questions to get a clearer picture, and making suggestions that they think might help. I know you're worried and it's easy to feel defensive, but no one on this forum judges. We're all either in debt, or have been, so know what it's like.

The reason people, myself included, keep banging on about Payplan and CCCS is that they take over dealing with these creditors for your son and his partner and negotiate manageable payments, taking into account the fact that they're living on so little. If bankruptcy is the best option for them, then the agency will advise that; if not, they'll help with alternatives.

As you can see from my signature, I pad off in excess of £6,000 of debt while being on benefit, then working and being topped up with benefit and didn't have to go bankrupt. I am also a lone parent. I did it by getting help from the CAB to negotiate waiving the interest on the debts and then making very small payments to my creditors, also by querying all my spending and learning how to budget. It has taken me years, but it is possible and, like others on the forum, I'm just trying to supply ideas and encouragement to a young family in debt.

Please contact one of those agencies and I'm sure it will give them peace of mind as well as assistance.

Very best wishes to you all.

Mirtos

ixworth wrote:

I'm sorry but I'm feeling a little defensive on my son's behalf here...

Petrol: £40 / month equates to about 60 miles a week which as our village is 10 miles from the nearest town equates to less than 1 trip to town every other day. Some of the job interviews are in Ipswich which is 25 miles away. I think, if anything, I've underestimated the petrol spend. Oh and we forgot car tax in the SOA which adds another £160 or so but I'll probably end up paying that.

Working: My son himself (through me) mentioned working in our earlier post. He has applied for many jobs but has no qualifications and can't get any job involving driving because of the DD on his licence. All of the jobs he has chased up offer minimum wage (just over £5/hour) and he is worried that taking such a job will leave him worse off financially because of the expenses involved with going to work (travel/food etc.).

Bailiffs: I know what the law says about bailiffs rights but I have also read tales of bailiffs pushing past women as they put babies into pushchairs, of pushing past people as they open the door and then saying they were invited in, of lying about who they are and then denying it afterwads, of banging loudly on doors for hours on end. We expect bailiffs to arrive and know what to expect. The original question was intended to seek information about the sort of protection against bailiffs bankruptcy would afford.

Food/Groceries: We did point out in our earlier reply that we though there was some slack in this budget and that it did include items strictly speaking not food/grocery-related. I expect this figure to come down to £200/month but they have a new baby which is undoubtedly going to throw some more financial spanners in the works that they haven't factored into the equations.

They have been trying to pay off their debts but won't be able to while surviving on benefits. The benefits system just about enables you to get by, it doesn't give you the means to pay existing debts on top of that especially if the creditors insist they want over £100 / month between them and won't budge.

Hi Ixworth :wave: please don't feel defensive - no one is attacking you or your son here, buut trying to see ways for you to save/make money, and help get you through this. We've all been in bad situations ourselves, so it's very rare that people will judge you - just try to offer constructive criticism as a way of helping :)I had another thought - as your son has no qualifications, has he tried contacting learn direct as a way to get some? - there are lots of free courses that he can do part time or in the evenings/ weekends that will help him GET qualifications and thus a better paid job - some are academic, and some are more vocational, so there's something for everyone. I know that is a long term thing rather than helping right now, but that baby is only going to get more expensive, and he needs to be able to continue to support himself and his family. In terms on bankruptcy advice, cccs or payplan are free charities who offer support and counselling to people with debt - please contact them asap. It sounds harsh to say and I appreciate how hard it is as a mum NOT to help, but as long as you are supporting your son, and helping him solve his problems, he'll never learn to do so himself. I'm speaking from experience here and am not trying to be mean, but I really think you should encourage him to take more responsibility for his actions by resolving this situation himself.