House Prices

motorguy

warmhands.coldheart wrote: »

Fair enough if you don't Need to get rid of it (Obviously your not short of a penny )

All i'm saying is a lot of people will be holding onto their houses for a very long time (yourself included... again OK if you don't need the money in any hurray) as they are overpriced for the current market conditions and there's no sign of it getting any better in the near future..

Yeah, fair enough, we're in a quite fortunate financial situation with regards to the new house we've built, so we can afford to hold on to ours and i appreciate that some people *have* to sell their houses. But the flip side of that is that a lot of people who want to move house dont necessarily *need* to, so therefore probably arent feeling a big urge to sell at the bargain basement prices that some developers are.

Previously you could almost find the house you want, agree a price and THEN sell your own, whereas now i think sellers are saying well if it takes 2 years to sell then fair enough, we'll look around then.

With regard to your example of the people asking £180K for the last two years, maybe they are of the opinion 'this is the price we want, if we dont get that then we wont sell' and are happy for the sign to stay up as long as it takes

motorguy

tara747 wrote: »

:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

Care to elaborate?

caz2703

Can anyone explain a bit more about capital gains? I thought that it was the case that if you bought a Buy To Let then when you come to sell regardless of the timeframe, you were hit with tax on any profit but if you were to pump that profit back into the house e.g. double glazing, pvc fascias & soffits, new patio etc then you don't get taxed. There's two ways of looking at profit though: you can get more in rent than you pay in a mortgage and the amount of money you get when selling the house above the cost you paid for it.

warmhands.coldheart

Caz,
Buy to lets are a different kettle of fish.

In the private housing market, if you move house, basically Capital gains tax doesn't kick in untill after 36 months... I presume thats to allow the owner time to sell the house ( or in some cases allow them to rent it for 24 months then sell it :rotfl:)

Buy to Let is seen as an investment so no matter when you sell it, after deductions, you have to pay tax on any profit.... As you say, you're then getting into the whole bigger tax issues like investing back into the property etc etc etc.....

Big problem now for the private renters trying to "fiddle" the system is that the Tax Man is now short of cash and I believe that if the Tax Man goes into an estate agent and asks for all records of rented properties they have (have had) on their books... they have to give them to him.... Then off he goes to track down the private landlord not declaring his portfolio of properties and all associated taxes !! :eek:

tara747

pgilc1 wrote: »

Relative to what i believe its true worth is, then yes it is. (to me anyway).

The current market price drivers at the minute seem to be lack of mortgages for first time buyers / lack of decent mortgage deals, a lot of builders selling houses off cheap to increase their cashflow and a lot of people with no urge not to pay anywhere near the asking price.

And that, my friend, is why your house won't be selling anytime in the next few years if you don't drop the price. Don't forget, most commentators accept that we are headed for a double dip recession whose effects will be felt most keenly in NI (massive public sector).

pgilc1 wrote: »

Care to elaborate?

Yes, your notion that £145k would represent 'giving it away' made me laugh. I guess that's how a lot of accidental landlords have been born in the last couple of years, and boy are they sorry now. I know several people who bitterly regret not selling when they had the chance, even below peak price. Yes, I know that your house used to be 'worth' £280k on paper, but the fact that you did not sell at that price means that the notional gain was never realised.

Did you think that the previous owner 'gave it away' to you at £128k?

Why do you think that £180k represents fair value for your house? What have other similar houses in the area sold for? What is the area, incidentally? Just curious.

Anyway, good luck and I am glad that you are comfortable financially with not selling your house - you are luckier than most sellers in that way.

leftieM

Owners may not be willing to sell at current (still high) prices. However, you sell for 40% below peak, you buy for 40% below peak and, happy days, you have a smaller mortgage than you would have had a year ago or more.

As a buyer there is just no rush. Prices are still high and given that interest rates are really low, if you borrow too much now you could be in major noo noo in short to medium term when they rise.
Plus, no matter what a vendor thinks their house is worth, if the mortgage lender says no then the sale will not happen. Buyers are not free to set house prices. Ultimately banks set house prices.

motorguy

leftieM wrote: »

Owners may not be willing to sell at current (still high) prices. However, you sell for 40% below peak, you buy for 40% below peak and, happy days, you have a smaller mortgage than you would have had a year ago or more.

As a buyer there is just no rush. Prices are still high and given that interest rates are really low, if you borrow too much now you could be in major noo noo in short to medium term when they rise.
Plus, no matter what a vendor thinks their house is worth, if the mortgage lender says no then the sale will not happen. Buyers are not free to set house prices. Ultimately banks set house prices.

The situation was slightly different for us in that we were building our own house and the price was agreed with the contractor last April. Now we were able to get it built for less than expected due to lower labour rates, but i'd say our own house dropped maybe £30K over that timeframe.

motorguy

tara747 wrote: »

And that, my friend, is why your house won't be selling anytime in the next few years if you don't drop the price. Don't forget, most commentators accept that we are headed for a double dip recession whose effects will be felt most keenly in NI (massive public sector).

Whats with the condescending 'my friend'?

I guess we'll have to wait and see. If i can do it, i'd happily keep the house indefinitely.

tara747 wrote: »

Yes, your notion that £145k would represent 'giving it away' made me laugh. I guess that's how a lot of accidental landlords have been born in the last couple of years, and boy are they sorry now.

I think there were a lot of greedy people who thought prices could only go up. Also, there were a lot of people who didnt accept that prices were on a downward spiral, and, you're right, should have got out when they could.

tara747 wrote: »

I know several people who bitterly regret not selling when they had the chance, even below peak price. Yes, I know that your house used to be 'worth' £280k on paper, but the fact that you did not sell at that price means that the notional gain was never realised.

If you read what i wrote i never said it was *worth* £280K, merely at the peak of the market it may well have made that.

tara747 wrote: »

Did you think that the previous owner 'gave it away' to you at £128k?

It was a new build in a development. I do think the developer underpriced it. In fact, he put his prices up by £20K when the sale of ours was completed.

tara747 wrote: »

Why do you think that £180k represents fair value for your house? What have other similar houses in the area sold for? What is the area, incidentally? Just curious.

Anyway, good luck and I am glad that you are comfortable financially with not selling your house - you are luckier than most sellers in that way.

The area is waringstown, co armagh.

Decent newish 3 bed semis are on the market for around the £130K mark (+/- £10K) - (in fact some semis are on the market for £210K!!!) with no garage. Ours is four bed, detached, significantly larger, en suite, extended width and extended length garage, brick driveway, upgraded heating system, high standard of finish (a lot in the area are basic finished turnkey) and on a good site.

I would be loathe to sell ours for maybe as little as £10K more.

Old_Git

I think house prices at the moment are at 2005 level .Time will tell how far they will fall .

leftieM

Old_Git wrote: »

I think house prices at the moment are at 2005 level .Time will tell how far they will fall .

There is no price transparency so it's really hard to tell how far prices have fallen. Many sellers are like pgilc. They want more for their house than anyone is willing to pay so you have an impasse. Seller sits with unsold house for months/ years and buyers sit in rented houses/at home with parents.

When a house comes on the market at a price that undercuts the stubborn neighbour and sells quickly that is usually the end of the wannabe vendor's fantasy. A house on my street sold in a week for less than 200k. I guess it would have sold for 350k (based on its published capital value of 170k) at the height of the madness. That has set a new price for the street for valuers. Sellers will have to price their houses in relation to that house to have a hope of selling to anyone requiring a mortgage.