Gordon Brown the liar

Kohoutek

It's impossible to reconcile their interests - because private equity is about making the rich richer at the expense of ordinary workers, and trade unions are about protecting workers' rights and job security.

What valid interests do the private equity industry have that the Prime Minster should represent - the right to enrich yourself by harming ordinary people? I thought we lived in a democracy, not a plutocracy.

What Gordon Brown is doing is like being the best mate of Arthur Scargill and Gordon Gekko simultaneously, it's absurd at best and extremely dishonest and disingenuous at worst.

ninky_2

Kohoutek wrote: »

It's impossible to reconcile their interests - because private equity is about making the rich richer at the expense of ordinary workers, and trade unions are about protecting workers' rights and job security.

What valid interests do the private equity industry have that the Prime Minster should represent - the right to enrich yourself by harming ordinary people? I thought we lived in a democracy, not a plutocracy.

What Gordon Brown is doing is like being the best mate of Arthur Scargill and Gordon Gekko simultaneously, it's absurd at best and extremely dishonest and disingenuous at worst.

from an old school marxist perspective maybe. but this is all very Us and Them. the reality is that most people have some sort of interest stake in both sides. whether that is just taxation of private equity profits that help fund the health service or whatever. personally I'd like to see a lot more state run industries. but should the state run / own absolutely everything? i'm not convinced of that. and if it doesn't then private equity interests need to be taken into account somewhere along the line.

i think there is a difference between reconciliation and balance however. that is why i used the term balance. this is what all the main political parties aim to do really, only coming out in favour of certain groups in particular areas.

Kohoutek

I don't really understand why you're defending the private equity industry.

Private equity is not the opposite of the state running everything. Private equity means when you borrow huge amounts of money to take over a public company (i.e. where any member of the public can buy shares, like Tesco) and convert it into a private company. Then, you change the company's constitution to make it responsible for all the debts you have incurred financing its takeover and enrich yourself by making the company pay you a dividend.

It's what the Glazers have done at Manchester United - now the same proportion of the club's income that goes on wages goes on paying the interest on their debts, and they award themselves dividends every years. Brilliant for the Glazer family and their creditors, terrible for the players, the staff and the fans.

The private equity industry makes money by converting their companies back into public companies, but at a higher price than they bought them. They do this by 'streamlining' the company - i.e. firing people. Here's an example from Unite's website.

When a coalition of PE investors, including KKR, took over German telecom company Tenovis in 2000, they reportedly laid off 2,500 of the 8,000 workers—and forced some of the remaining workers to accept a 12.5 percent paycut in exchange for the right to keep working. KKR bought the company for $400 million, and sold it for more than 50 percent more: $635 million.

Because it is a capital gain, they pay a lower rate of tax than income - 18%. However, they use armies of tax accountants and lawyers to make sure they pay as little as possible.

Do you still think I am a 'old school Marxist' for criticising what is basically a scam to help rich people get richer? Private equity doesn't add jobs, or add investment, it just transfers some more wealth from the average person to the super-rich. Why do the interests of billionaires and ordinary people need to be 'balanced'? They're hardly starting from a fair bargaining position...

LisbonLaura

What a frightening thread.
Seems almost everyone believes these chosen people actually have free will.
No mention of who pulls the puppet politicians strings.
Brown isn't deluded, he is doing exactly as he is told.
Get real - You live in a pseudo democracy.
DYOR!!!!

Note:- Attacking the messenger is the usual next step

Kohoutek

Who are the puppetmasters?

The European Commission? The Trilateral Commission? International Bankers? David Rockefeller?

It's difficult to know the exact nature of the purported 'New World Order' that some people like to refer to. What are your views?

spaceboy

1984ReturnsForReal wrote: »

& you think the Cons would be better... :rotfl:

The point is Labour are in power and have been lying and screwing up the economy. You shouldnt vote to keep failures in power, what message does that send out? You can vote Lib Dem if you hate the Tories so much (which you obviously do)

spaceboy

LisbonLaura wrote: »

What a frightening thread.
Seems almost everyone believes these chosen people actually have free will.
No mention of who pulls the puppet politicians strings.
Brown isn't deluded, he is doing exactly as he is told.
Get real - You live in a pseudo democracy.
DYOR!!!!

Note:- Attacking the messenger is the usual next step

Seems you are ever so slightly deluded too.