58% of properties can be bought by "average income"

chucky

Graham_Devon wrote: »

Get it then.

you've posted it before - the bottom two quintiles are skewed by benefits i imagine.

this is what skews the average salary argument too in relation to affordability

Graham_Devon wrote: »

Infact, just to nip this one in the bud...

http://www.statistics.gov.uk/cci/nugget.asp?id=334

No VI, no spin, just raw statistics.

Total family income of all families averages out at less than 30k in 2006/7.

The top fifth of the country have an average of just over 50k.

Yet you are saying the average is 45k!??!?!? You have over egged the figures by over a third.



So if you could kindly do your maths again, I would be grateful.

Also, when renting an average £550 a month house, paying around 10k in tax, paying another 1k in council tax, 1k in domestic fuel etc, the family is left with around 12k per year for everything.

We haven't looked at food, clothing, transport, nothing like that.

So can you re-do your assuption that people just have 20k sitting spare in deposit funds!!?

Thrugelmir

HAMISH_MCTAVISH wrote: »

Because deposit levels are too high.

Deposit levels need to rise to bridge the funding gap. Lending multiples need to fall, on average. As the major lenders have a hole of around £500 billion between money lent and deposits. Currently the bulk of this is being provided with Government assistance. At some point the banks will have to be weaned off this.

Interesting thats LloydsHbos is actively encouraging mortgage overpayments, and has changed the terms of existing borrowers to accomadate this.

Graham_Devon

chucky wrote: »

you've posted it before - the bottom two quintiles are skewed by benefits i imagine.

this is what skews the average salary argument too in relation to affordability

LOL. Would you like a bigger spade?

You imagine.

Rigggghhht.

You may want to check out the very first line in the paragraph explaining the graph which states "Original income, before taxes and benefits"

Tell you what, why don't you throw me the "you don't get it" line. That's the usual tact right about now.

That graph basically splits incomes. It gives both benefit top ups and original.

What that graph ISN'T isnan average income graph. Which is what Hamish and I were talking about, and the only I am asking you to post.

silvercar

greggymagic wrote: »

5 people earn 1 million pounds each: £5,000,000

95 people earn 10,000 pounds each: £950,000

Total for 100 workers = £5,950,000

Average per worker = £59,950

Try telling those 95 percent of workers that there's no problem and that houses are affordable.

But then in this wonderful world the answer would be that those 95 workers shouldn't or don't deserve to be able to afford a house and wouldn't be the typical house buyer.

And I speak as a thirtysomething homeowner.

Which shows why you look at the median rather than the mean.

silvercar

DaddyBear wrote: »

58% hey?

Lets try my area.

Number of properties for sale on rightmove..... 590
Median local wage (ONS)........................ £23,500
Number of properties for sale under 95k.......... 18 (that aren't long boats, caravans and retirement homes)
Number of properties for sale under 190k........ 130


So, at 4x income a single person can afford 3% of properties in Bath and a couple on 4x joint income can afford 22% of properties in Bath

Another quality link from Hamish. :rotfl::T:rotfl:

Firstly, Bath is expensive. Some people would be able to afford to buy if they bought further out and commuted into Bath.

Secondly, a lot of the 130 properties under 130k will not be FTB properties, so people sell their FTB homes and move to a larger home.

chucky

Graham_Devon wrote: »

LOL. Would you like a bigger spade?

You imagine.

Rigggghhht.

You may want to check out the very first line in the paragraph explaining the graph which states "Original income, before taxes and benefits"

Tell you what, why don't you throw me the "you don't get it" line. That's the usual tact right about now.

you're comparing oranges and apples again, seeing that was taken from a completely different thread and topic.

i actually agree with the questioning of Hamish as i don't agree with him but unfortunately you don't seem bright enough

Graham_Devon wrote: »

That graph basically splits incomes. It gives both benefit top ups and original.

What that graph ISN'T isnan average income graph. Which is what Hamish and I were talking about, and the only I am asking you to post.

well it's not the same graph then - it's quite simple

i'm not finding the one Hamish is asking you for because you reply with the nonsense above.

get yourself a life...

Thrugelmir

Cleaver wrote: »

They can. As we've seen, the average couple earn about 50k between 'em, right? And isn't Swindon meant to be the most average place in the UK? Well, Mr and Mrs Average can go and buy this average house in Swindon for £160,000 (which I think is about the average price at the mo). A 3-bed semi - it doesn't get more average than that.



So there we go. Average people, buying an average house, at an average price, in an average place for a nice, standard, average 3 times income.

Of course, this isn't much good to someone in Kent. Or someone who works in Leeds. Or a couple who earn well above the average wage but have three kids and live in Cornwall where houses are stupid prices. Or someone who is single and earns double the national average but wants to live in Camden. And so on, and so on and so on.

But the point above still stands. The average house buyer (i.e.a couple) can buy an average house, in an average place at an affordable, average cost. This doesn't mean anything real to anyone, but it's true.

Interesting choice of location.

The house is fairly representative of a large part of Swindon.

However identical houses such as the one you've shown vary in price depending upon the location.

A similar detached property requiring total modernisation sold for £212k just up the road from me in December 2009.

So I would sum it that people buy what they can afford to. People determine the price of property in the market. And will in most instances borrow the maximum they are able to in order to fulfill their dreams.

chucky

silvercar wrote: »

Firstly, Bath is expensive. Some people would be able to afford to buy if they bought further out and commuted into Bath.

Secondly, a lot of the 130 properties under 130k will not be FTB properties, so people sell their FTB homes and move to a larger home.

this is the point that most of the bearish posters on here miss completely.

that goes for you too Hamish average salaries is not the right way to compare affordability against property prices.

they bang on about affordability but they don't realise why property is unaffordable.

i'll let them try and figure it out from the bold bit.

chucky wrote: »

i know this, you know but most people on here don't realise that the bottom two quintiles of salaries will not be able to buy a property

the ratio of low salary vs cheapest properties on the market has reduced in the last 10 years - this is what the less bright bearish posters miss completely.

it's a bearish point but it's a better made point with regards to affordability that they don't understand.

Graham_Devon

Chucky, it's not that people miss the point. You are constantly stating this.

It's that you keep creating your own points. And not everyone agrees with you.

chucky

Graham_Devon wrote: »

Chucky, it's not that people miss the point. You are constantly stating this.

It's that you keep creating your own points. And not everyone agrees with you.

no Graham, you don't understand or you don't want to understand because a person you categorise as a 'bull' points it out.
this is why people laugh and mock you.

the reason that people on the 'average salary' or below 'average salary' cannot afford property is because there is not enough lower priced property that fits their income bracket/multiples.

this is because the properties that were in this bracket 10 years ago have moved up in price and new property has not been built to replace them in these lower price brackets. this is fact.

this is the demand and supply issue that you miss on countless occasions.

the average salary affordability issue is a red herring