Pensions Planning: The NUMBER

Smudgeismydog

Great update, sounds like you are in a very healthy position, and living a very full retirement
Good for you 

MarriedWithKids89

End of 2025 Results:
Retired couple 58/60, MCOL, No mortgage, 1 car, no dependents, no pets. 

- Subsistence (day to day living costs including utilities and insurances): £15914
- Non-Discretionary CAPEX (e.g. car/house repairs, home improvements, white goods, furniture, etc.): £5278*
- Discretionary CAPEX (e.g. holidays, short breaks, days out, meals, takeaways, etc.): £23908**

* Includes a car repair and new patio amongst other things.
** Includes £13K spent on a 3 week holiday to New Zealand. 

Can provide a little more insight if it helps anyone. Good luck everyone.

LL_USS

@MarriedWithKids89 now there's hope for those of us who want to see if we can live on low to moderate retirement funding 

I suppose this is not living in those bigger and more expensive cities.... 

I will stay in my current city and won't try to move to near the kids if living costs are high still during my retirement...

ex-pat_scot

LL_USS said:

@MarriedWithKids89 now there's hope for those of us who want to see if we can live on low to moderate retirement funding 

I suppose this is not living in those bigger and more expensive cities.... 

I will stay in my current city and won't try to move to near the kids if living costs are high still during my retirement...

I make that getting on for £45,000 net. 
(or £32,000 plus NZ).

That's moderate-to-generous, in my book, rather than low-to-moderate! £3,750/m. No rent/mortgage.

Cars, and holidays, and grandchildren, can indeed be a really punchy cost for many.

I've no real idea of actuals, as we are not yet near a steady state of spending post-work and post-children. We have lots, and they are some way from being off the payroll.
I'm expecting that the base running costs will be £2000 to £2250 / month for us.

This will be the utilities, insurances, oil & elec, maintenance, car running costs, food.
Anything above that starts to become discretionary - gifts, clothes, capex (inc car), holidays etc.

I have a vague "£5,000 per month ought to be nicely comfortable" notion, recognising that this is not going to be linear throughout retirement, and will need a bit of jiggery-pokery with SIPP juggling before State Pensions kick in.

I'm not keen to play the game of follow-the-children, as the transaction costs are high, and would likely be to SE commuter belt / London which would require additional capital.
Any cities feel really expensive these days, compared to our rural N Yorks idyll. Stuff like parking, endless coffee shops, shopping-as-a-leisure-pursuit. 

MarriedWithKids89

LL_USS said:

@MarriedWithKids89 now there's hope for those of us who want to see if we can live on low to moderate retirement funding 

I suppose this is not living in those bigger and more expensive cities.... 

I will stay in my current city and won't try to move to near the kids if living costs are high still during my retirement...

We're about an hour outside of London but in a relatively cheap area given the locale. Of course, everyone's retirement looks (and costs) different, and one needs to plan accordingly. For what it's worth, when we originally retired we budgeted £12K per annum on discretionary spending (e.g. holidays, short breaks, days out, meals, takeaways, luxuries, etc.) but we actually struggled to spend it all ... at first ;o)

LL_USS

MarriedWithKids89 said:

We're about an hour outside of London but in a relatively cheap area given the locale. Of course, everyone's retirement looks (and costs) different, and one needs to plan accordingly. For what it's worth, when we originally retired we budgeted £12K per annum on discretionary spending (e.g. holidays, short breaks, days out, meals, takeaways, luxuries, etc.) but we actually struggled to spend it all ... at first ;o)

Thank you. I am trying to work out the minimum I would need (i.e. just like your subsistence part) - then plan to work till my Defined Benefit can cover that (if I retire earlier than that then whether enough saving to bridge till taking out the DB). 

I have calculated to see that I can (just) survive with about 14,000 net a year (in today's money) in a relatively lower-cost of living city. If we still have state pension when I turn 68 then it'll be a bonus. 

This is just to plan how long I should definitely work until, if I want to help the kids. 

MarriedWithKids89

@LL_USS I suspect we could easily cut our subsistence spending by £2K-£3K so £14K per annum seems highly do-able to me. Just don't forget about irregular (but usually expensive spending) like household/vehicle repairs and replacing furniture and electrical goods. These expenses might only occur infrequently but could cost £K's when they do.

LL_USS

Thank you @MarriedWithKids89 - that's true.
I plan to always maintain about 70K on ISA for irregulars already so my no-frills minimum number may be okay then. I will still be careful keeping enough saving to have a bit more comfort.

WillC999

Interested in the discussion re. fiscal drag (freezing tax bands) and how best to get money out in retirement. My current thinking is start DB at 56 (about 12k, covers essentials, a sort of annuity feel…) and top up with SIPP (front loaded) until SP starts at 68. Aim is to empty SIPP (spend, to ISA) under the 50k band.

A second option is to put off the DB until 65 (about 18k) and use just the SIPP to bridge to SP at 68.

I prefer the first option, for the annuity feel of the DB and seeing SIPP as a 'fun fund'. I dislike the second option as although the amount of eventual fixed income is higher (about 30k), it comes later.

I'm trying to work out if either is better, in terms of risk, financials, or avoiding hitting the 50k threshold (which as someone pointed out is effectively decreasing each year with fiscal drag).

Anyone got any words of wisdom to impart?

Cheers

NoMore

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82004653#Comment_82004653

Probably best starting your own thread, as this thread isn't specifically about withdrawal strategies and tax planning but merely the number you believe you need in retirement.

Plus despite their intention pinned threads seem to get less traffic over time than fresh threads.