Unenforceability & Template Letters II

zondervan_2

never-in-doubt wrote: »

The terms were normally down the left so it may well be original. However, can you confirm on here: http://i873.photobucket.com/albums/ab294/zondervan1/MBNA%20Plat%20Plus%20CCA/SCAN0025.jpg

whether point 2 down the left actually has an APR or does it read along the lines of 'we will chose your interest rate'? I cannot see what it says?

Basically if this is your original form (you should know with the handwriting) then I don't think you have much to argue over, other than lack of prescribed terms, in which case i'd send the 3. CCA Query letter regardless.

The actual terms and conditions state:

Set out in paragraphs 1-15 below are some of the provisions contained in Conditions 1 & 2 of the MBNA Credit Card Terms and Conditions. The other conditions referred to in these paragraphs and the applicable definitions can be found in those Terms & Conditions.

1. We will from time to time choose the credit limit and notify you of this.

2. We will choose the first statement date, later statement dates will fall approximately one month apart, if you ask we may change the statement date.

7. This table shows how the APR depends on the type of transaction, when interest is charged and the credit limit (the table itself is somewhat blurred and hard to read).

never-in-doubt

zondervan wrote: »

The 2007 terms and condtions do not have my signature on, and don't seem to be of any direct relevance to my account.

Only the 2001 credit card application form has my signature on. Cahoot haven't supplied me with a copy of the relevant terms and conditions applicable when my account was opened in 2001.

Then it is unenforceable until such time they do. They must send a copy of the terms set in place at account inception and a recent (the most current up-to-date) version, in order to satisfy s.77-s.79.

never-in-doubt

zondervan wrote: »

The actual terms and conditions state:

Set out in paragraphs 1-15 below are some of the provisions contained in Conditions 1 & 2 of the MBNA Credit Card Terms and Conditions. The other conditions referred to in these paragraphs and the applicable definitions can be found in those Terms & Conditions.

1. We will from time to time choose the credit limit and notify you of this.

2. We will choose the first statement date, later statement dates will fall approximately one month apart, if you ask we may change the statement date.

7. This table shows how the APR depends on the type of transaction, when interest is charged and the credit limit (the table itself is somewhat blurred and hard to read).

I'd be tempted to send this back, see what they respond with mate: 4. CCA Dispute

wiseways

Can anybody answer my question about barclaycard/morgan stanley merger

My friend had a morgan stanley card from 2003 it was at some point taken over by barclaycard, he has recently asked for the cca, they have sent a cca, the original with morgan stanley company heading. Are Barclaycard able to enforce this agreement, since my friend did not sign any new terms and conditions with barclaycard. He has offered them a full and final which they have rejected, so asked for the cca. His next step is to ask for a list of charges since he has paid a lot of charges over the years. Basically he believes that the remaining amount owing has been more than paid in charges alone, but needs to know how enforceable the original cca is if it was with morgan stanley and not barclaycard. Any help would be appreciated. Thanx

James3891

Hi got some good advice from here recently from NID especially.Was ready to send a CCA dispute letter and get it back to the original DCA.

It now turns out my mum CCA'd the DCA handling it at that time which was actually the 2nd DCA (nothing ever received from them ) so can it just get sent back to them or should the original (1st) DCA have been CCA'd really?.

Thanks.

never-in-doubt

James3891 wrote: »

Hi got some good advice from here recently from NID especially.Was ready to send a CCA dispute letter and get it back to the original DCA.

It now turns out my mum CCA'd the DCA handling it at that time which was actually the 2nd DCA (nothing ever received from them ) so can it just get sent back to them or should the original (1st) DCA have been CCA'd really?.

Thanks.

Hiya

when you send a CCA request it states on there, what they should do:

If it is your view that you are not the creditor, s.175 of the CCA1974 applies in the case of a simple assignment, and places a duty upon you to pass this request to the creditor. In the case of an absolute assignment, you are a creditor as defined by s.189. If you contend that you purchased the rights but not the duties of any agreement, you are reminded that s.189 of the Act is clear that an assignment is of both rights and duties. Your attention is drawn to ss.5(2), 3(b), 6 and 7 of the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 (CPUTR).

So if they have ignored you then you simply send the next letter in sequence from page 1

never-in-doubt

wiseways wrote: »

Can anybody answer my question about barclaycard/morgan stanley merger

My friend had a morgan stanley card from 2003 it was at some point taken over by barclaycard, he has recently asked for the cca, they have sent a cca, the original with morgan stanley company heading. Are Barclaycard able to enforce this agreement, since my friend did not sign any new terms and conditions with barclaycard. He has offered them a full and final which they have rejected, so asked for the cca. His next step is to ask for a list of charges since he has paid a lot of charges over the years. Basically he believes that the remaining amount owing has been more than paid in charges alone, but needs to know how enforceable the original cca is if it was with morgan stanley and not barclaycard. Any help would be appreciated. Thanx

Yes it would still be enforceable so long as the prescribed terms etc are intact, the fact that the card changed ownership doesn't mean much, you would have been sent a copy of Barclays terms at the changeover, the rest would have remained or you'd have been notified (i.e. change of card/apr/limit).

Basically, you need to forget the transfer of the account and look at the content of what you have been sent, i.e. is it an original agreement with signature or is it a copy without a signature that 'may' suggest it is a reconstituted version?

Wispa1

never-in-doubt wrote: »

Commission cheque in the post I assume :rotfl: :rotfl:

Not a problem - have a beer on me :beer:

libbyjade

I was considering going with a CMC initially to see if my CCA's were unenforceable, however with NID's superb advice & fast service I've decided to go it alone (well partially alone ) :j

One of the things the CMC advised me was that there are plenty of ways of proving if the debt is unenforceable, one being that I should have been provided with a brand new cca from the new company taking over any original credit companies. I was made up as several of mine had been involved in take overs!

Given NID's response to you, it looks like another below the belt attempt from the CMC at enticing me to sign up with them that would have led to a negative outcome! :mad:

never-in-doubt wrote: »

Yes it would still be enforceable so long as the prescribed terms etc are intact, the fact that the card changed ownership doesn't mean much, you would have been sent a copy of Barclays terms at the changeover, the rest would have remained or you'd have been notified (i.e. change of card/apr/limit).

Basically, you need to forget the transfer of the account and look at the content of what you have been sent, i.e. is it an original agreement with signature or is it a copy without a signature that 'may' suggest it is a reconstituted version?

never-in-doubt

libbyjade wrote: »

One of the things the CMC advised me was that there are plenty of ways of proving if the debt is unenforceable, one being that I should have been provided with a brand new cca from the new company taking over any original credit companies. I was made up as several of mine had been involved in take overs!:mad:

Sorry but at the end of the day the OP took out a Morgan Stanley card and therefore they only need to produce a Morgan Stanley agreement....

Wasn't it:- Morgan Stanley -> Goldfish -> Barclaycard

see similar threads over on CAG - to see how to beat them!

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/dca-legal-successes/168312-morgan-stanley-cca-received.html

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/debt-collection-industry/165349-smt37-morgan-stanley-goldfish.html

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/barclaycard/210467-barclaycard-ex-morgan-stanley.html (ignore the CPR action that the site team states - not worth it right now)....