Conveyancers Dispute (Common Land) Help? (FTB)

Knub

Hi,

I am currently in the process of buying a house that has a grassy strip of land the between two rows of houses down the street. There is also a field next to where the houses are. This is all considered common land and every resident owns a little part of it incase anyone ever tried to build/change it - it would require everyones permission. Everyone pays £20 when they move in to secure this arrangement.

This is the story as I understand it from the vendor, who is a nice lady, I have no reason to doubt her. It seems legitamate enough and is custom and practice down the street.

We have come to a stale-mate between our conveyancer and the vendors solicitors. Everything is completed (land reg, enviro search, etc) except my conveyancers enquiries, specifically ones regarding the common areas.

The main issue seems to be that my guy tells me that they are not providing answers to simple basic questions reagrding this land. Such as any deed to say the residents committee own that area and accounts information, etc.

This has been going on a while now and is slowing up proceedings. I came to the decision to tell my conveyancer to continue with the contracts and moving on to completion regardless of the enquiries not being answered.

He has told me that if he does not have this basic information that the mortgage provider (Abbey) will not give him the go ahead when he moves to contracts/completion.

Speaking to the vendor , the committee have provided everything they can. I trust her in everything she has said and can see that this is really not a big deal. If every other house had to get this "vital" information before selling/buying then the information would be readily available, surely? However at the same time I don't understand why they cant provide it.

My quesiton mainly is do you think that Abbey would put a stop to the process if this information isn't present? Is my conveyancer just being a little OTT in his duties?


My current course of action is that I contacted my conveyancer Friday to request the exact information he has asked their solicitor for and all correspondance regarding this issue so I can drill down into it and work out exactly whats going on.

Any thoughts would help and would be greatly apprecaited!

This has held us up for a month already and I dont seem to be getting anywhere. I just want him to crack on and get things completed!

foreversummer

Why don't you knock on a few doors, explain that you are thinking of buying a house there and ask their take on it. You should get some honest answers I am sure and you would soon get an idea if anything sounds dodgy.

A great way of meeting your new neighbours anyway, if everything goes well!

Foreversummer

DVardysShadow

Knub wrote: »

Hi,

I am currently in the process of buying a house that has a grassy strip of land the between two rows of houses down the street. There is also a field next to where the houses are. This is all considered common land and every resident owns a little part of it incase anyone ever tried to build/change it - it would require everyones permission. Everyone pays £20 when they move in to secure this arrangement.This is the story as I understand it from the vendor, who is a nice lady, I have no reason to doubt her. It seems legitamate enough and is custom and practice down the street.

As buyer, you have to think that she, as vendor would say that wouldn't she.

We have come to a stale-mate between our conveyancer and the vendors solicitors. Everything is completed (land reg, enviro search, etc) except my conveyancers enquiries, specifically ones regarding the common areas.

The main issue seems to be that my guy tells me that they are not providing answers to simple basic questions reagrding this land. Such as any deed to say the residents committee own that area and accounts information, etc.

This has been going on a while now and is slowing up proceedings. I came to the decision to tell my conveyancer to continue with the contracts and moving on to completion regardless of the enquiries not being answered.

Fair enough, provided you know you are proceeding at risk

He has told me that if he does not have this basic information that the mortgage provider (Abbey) will not give him the go ahead when he moves to contracts/completion.

More the case that he, in his role as Abbey's solicitor would notionally advise them not to go ahead and stop the deal. But this is the one lever you have to get anything from the vendor. Don't try and knock it down.

Speaking to the vendor , the committee have provided everything they can. I trust her in everything she has said and can see that this is really not a big deal. If every other house had to get this "vital" information before selling/buying then the information would be readily available, surely?

Vendors always say "this is not a big deal", but then they are moving out.

However at the same time I don't understand why they cant provide it.

Yes, you are right to question this. Now look at what you get if the rights in question cannot be assigned to you. Is the property any good to you? Is the price still right? These are the questions you must answer for yourself before you go too much further.

My quesiton mainly is do you think that Abbey would put a stop to the process if this information isn't present? Is my conveyancer just being a little OTT in his duties?

Abbey might put a stop to it, but your conveyancer is doing his job correctly. If you were repo'd without the rights in question, Abbey might not be able to sell and recover their losses. In your position, if I knew it was going this way and I still wanted the property, I would get Abbey to revalue without the rights, before they got quite to the point of saying NO.

My current course of action is that I contacted my conveyancer Friday to request the exact information he has asked their solicitor for and all correspondance regarding this issue so I can drill down into it and work out exactly whats going on.

That's the right way to go. You could go onto the Landreg site and buy title docs for the land in question if it is registered. This would show you who owned it and what rights were registerd against it.

Any thoughts would help and would be greatly apprecaited!

This has held us up for a month already and I dont seem to be getting anywhere. I just want him to crack on and get things completed!

With this problem, plan for at least 6 months to sort it. You may have to twist your vendor's arm to get her to buy the rights in actuality from a real land owner. She may have to provide a declaration backed by an indemnity policy. While the problem is still with your vendor you retain the power to walk away, but you lose that once you buy - plus when you come to sell you become vulnerable to your buyer's conveyancer raising the same issues.

If you really want the property, but do need the rights, consider it 6 months well spent and if it is less than 6 months, take it as a bonus.

Knub

DVardysShadow wrote: »

Advice

Wow, thanks for taking the time to reply, really great stuff!

I know it sounds naive/gullable, but I do get a genuine feel from this lady and what she has told us. Both our parents have met these people and my parents used to be Police officers and can smell a dodgy deal/rat a mile off. Having said that she could be very deceptive but I do doubt it..

The situation as we have been told it, is that when everyone moves into the road, they all pay a nominal fee to the residents commitee of £20. This commitee essentially own the land infront of the houses which would stop anyone making changes to it that aren't authorised by the residents. Building a block of flats on the nearby field for example. There are no other payments/charges incurred. The grass is cut by the local council. There was a drain cover that needed replacing a few years ago which was done using the money out of the fund that new residents pay when they move in. If any changes are to be made everyone essentially has a say.

There is nothing more to it according to the vendor and she says in the 20+ year of living there she has never paid anything else and there have never been any problems. Again, this is what she has told me so I have to take everything with a pinch of salt until we have gotten to the bottom of it all.

Reading your responce, I do think that my conveyancer is doing his job and that I should not wave the only ace in my sleeve of proceeding regardless, until we are 100% on the matter.

If it turned out we don't own the land with the other residents I can't see it being a major problem as the land infront is not big enough to build anything on, with the exception of the field across the road. It's mainly foot access to all the houses.

We do very much like the property and loved it when we decided to offer. The vendors have been nothing but wonderful, leaving us many things in the house for free (beds, cupboards, draws, curtain rails, etc, etc) because they are down sizing. The house is immaculate and has been modernised and well kept with lots of care and money spent (new central heating system, new kitchen, garage extension).

I think after receiving the correspondance from my conveyancer I am going to contact the vendor again and speak with her to try and really get hold of the exact information required. I am prepared to do what is neccessary to help things along, be it speaking with other reisdents, speaking with the committee chairman/secretary, whatever really.

I honestly don't think it is a HUGE deal, as houses have been sold/bought in the area so they must have been sold without the information or it was actually provided at the time.?... but at the same time I do realise why my conveyancer is getting a little "ancy" about it and that it MUST be sorted to our satisfaction before we go ahead.

Excuse my ignorance but what would a declaration backed by an indemnity policy mean exactly, with regards to the rights of the common area?

Thanks again for your reply!

DVardysShadow

Knub wrote: »

Excuse my ignorance but what would a declaration backed by an indemnity policy mean exactly, with regards to the rights of the common area?

Vendor delivers to you an oath as to the use, which hopefully should stand up after 20 years of use, but if it does not, then the insurance policy pays up. You get the vendor to provide this policy if you possibly can - via her solicitor.