Our builder won't give receipts for materials

MyUserNamesTaken

I've not asked you to explain the risks of using a Ltd company. I've asked you to explain the difference between using Dodgy Dave who put a leaflet through your door with just his mobile number or a Pole who you've been told does a good job by your next-door neighbour. You're comparing apples to pears, here.

You have stated that employing "immigrant" labour is more risky than Dodgy Dave the cowboy builder (by saying there are more risks when employing a foreign worker). I've asked you to explain the difference. If there is no difference, stop going on about immigrant workers.

You've not answered my questions about Free Market Economy within the EU, either. Either you agree to the Free Market Economy, or you don't. If you do, stop moaning about immigrant workers having a bad effect on the British Economy (which you did do in an earlier post, by the way). It seems you only agree with Free Market economics when it benefits you.

Wig

Once again it was just my opinion, that I dislike the notion of trade discounts. You even acknowledged that you knew it was just an ideality of mine which would never come true. (I agree)

I agree with you, I know it will never come true, but that doesn't stop me from having my opinion. Face it you made an insulting remark to me to try to belittle me, but it was a daft remark to make because it was only my opinion on trade discounts in general. So your attack backfired IMO because you can't say where my lack of comprehension lies, can you?

You can't say I have no business comprehension just because I say I would prefer it if (in an ideal world) trade discounts didn't exist. The two things are not related.

Careful_girl

I broke one of my metatarsels in the Olympics!! I wasn't competing though. Meant I could watch it though.:j
The football talk was more fun.
Love and peace,
CG.

Alan_M_2

MyUserNamesTaken wrote:

I've not asked you to explain the risks of using a Ltd company. I've asked you to explain the difference between using Dodgy Dave who put a leaflet through your door with just his mobile number or a Pole who you've been told does a good job by your next-door neighbour. You're comparing apples to pears, here.

You have stated that employing "immigrant" labour is more risky than Dodgy Dave the cowboy builder (by saying there are more risks when employing a foreign worker). I've asked you to explain the difference. If there is no difference, stop going on about immigrant workers.

You've not answered my questions about Free Market Economy within the EU, either. Either you agree to the Free Market Economy, or you don't. If you do, stop moaning about immigrant workers having a bad effect on the British Economy (which you did do in an earlier post, by the way). It seems you only agree with Free Market economics when it benefits you.

I agree with the free market economy when it's played on a level field, my single biggest problem with immigrant labour is this is not the case, we're a soft target in Europe becasue our construction industry is unregulated and any Tom, !!!!!! or Milano can come in, call himself what He likes and set up an operation, not only can He do this, but He can do it tax free, remove all his income from the country once He's finished and in no way contribute to the economy. Even in the unlikely event that He registers in this country to pay tax, He can claim the majoirty of it back on leaving the country, you tell me another EU member state that will allow a UK citizen to do this?

This is detrimental to society as a whole, these people (on the whole) contirbute, no national insurance, no income tax and no Sales tax to the country. They are often not insured and require no premises or property in this country for the duration of their stay, without all these overheads they can quite clearly undercut any resident worker, unreasoanably.

Sure, you've given an opinion, an unworkable one that'll never happen because it can't as long as we live in a free market economy that's the lack of comprehension. I deal with what we have now and what is likely to happen in the future and bring on the day we're regulated, people will be screaming for the good old days where dogdy dave from the pub could come and do a few bits for them....they wouldn't have to pay the inflated regualted prices that will exist.

Allow me to ask a few pertinent questions.

Was your Polish Builder VAT registered? Or did you pay cash to avoid sales tax and take part in the daily tax fraud that the public of the UK find socially acceptable?

Was his work certified, did He provide all the required certification for the construction?

This is my point.

There will always be a black market economy no matter what nationality as long as there are people willing to accept work without tax or guarantee.

The influx of immigrant labour makes this even more rife, to such an extent that it will either bring the construction industry in general to it's knees or force regualtion, which do you think the government will allow?

bigchasbroon

MyUserNamesTaken wrote:

Support Us! If we hadn't qualified and you had, we'd all be backing you...
As long as a UK team is there, we should back it regardless of it being England, Wales, Scotland or Northern Ireland. (I would say that - I'm English. )

Yep I should I was working all over england in the summer of 96 during the euro championships and the feeling was great. Its a bit Ironic in that for years Scotland would have backed anyone who was playing against England even the argies in 86 just a few years after we were at war with them. But now just as there is a bit of an english backlash many socts especially younger ones (25 and below) are backing England.

I think the thing that turns people off north of the border is the national media, which becasue of the size of the countries is mainly english and the hype for us is really over the top. Rooneys metatarsel doesnt warrant headline news in my opinion.

rooney could be fit to play in tonights game with germany... and in other news there was bomb somewher in iraq, an american scientest has found the cure to cancer but lets get back to that report about Wayne Rooney.

But you should remember that rivalry is all part of football just look at the way manu and liverpool feel about each other or any of the London clubs or portsmouth and southampton its part of football.

madfrenchgirl

Alan_M wrote:

Actually I'm anything but a tight @!!!!!!, I think your chosen term describes quite accurately the posters who don't consider anyone as common and lowly as a "tradesman" should be making any profit from them...how dare a common working man possibly earn any of your money!

I started a business from sctratch, I've been broke, I've got up and started again, that's business.

The sheer irony of what you people expect, that margins should be so small that all buy for next to nothing, would simply mean business would fold and cease to be able to operate. You are then left with the monopolies of the world that are then in a position to charge exactly what they want and there's nothing you can do about it.

It's a prime example of the selfish I'm alright Jack" attitude that permeates through the grasping middle class culture of our society of which you appear to be a shining example.

Alan M

My grandad came to France from Spain during the economic boom to flee the dictatorship in place by Franco.

He started out cleaning sewers, doing the jobs the French people would not do because there were choices of jobs at that time.

He slowly learned the trade of building and tiling, got his own business in place and never practiced the way you practiced: whatever material he was buying was charged at the price he had bought because he was meant to be paid for his labour, not for the materials he was bringing in.

he is now retired, but dont come and tell me how middle-class and selfish I am or how i dont have any respect for tradesman or common people. I do admire people with entrepreneurship and the like BUT I totally despise people like you who make such a fuss about it and because they got that far without anyone's help, they are always hard and forget where they come from. Have you ever thought that OP was young and struggling before making such harsh judgements? Can you remember when you were struggling? how would you ahve felt like if someone was coming round to patronise you and treat you like crap straight away when you were asking for advice?

it was pretty obvious from your post how greedy you are and think you are always right even though people have proved you wrong.

As for being reported for advertising yourself ont his site, I do abide by it, the first time I saw your avatar (before the discussion got heated up), I thought you were quite cheeky to do that.

those comments are addressed to you, but not necessrily because you are a tradesman; you could have been a MD or a senior executive in any company, it is attitude like yours that dont help society.

" I am right because this is the way I do stuff and because I know better than anybody else: I am a self-made man"

Well congratulations, but that does not give you the right to overcharge for materials and criticising everyone and anyone who does not agree with you!

FELLOW MSERS

I propose that we ignore this ..... (fill in the blanks). The conversation was about helping the OP, not feed the agenda of mister "I am being repressed" here...

Deluks

Alan_M wrote:

I agree with the free market economy when it's played on a level field, my single biggest problem with immigrant labour is this is not the case, we're a soft target in Europe becasue our construction industry is unregulated and any Tom, !!!!!! or Milano can come in, call himself what He likes and set up an operation, not only can He do this, but He can do it tax free, remove all his income from the country once He's finished and in no way contribute to the economy. Even in the unlikely event that He registers in this country to pay tax, He can claim the majoirty of it back on leaving the country, you tell me another EU member state that will allow a UK citizen to do this?

This is detrimental to society as a whole, these people (on the whole) contirbute, no national insurance, no income tax and no Sales tax to the country. They are often not insured and require no premises or property in this country for the duration of their stay, without all these overheads they can quite clearly undercut any resident worker, unreasoanably.
There will always be a black market economy no matter what nationality as long as there are people willing to accept work without tax or guarantee.

The influx of immigrant labour makes this even more rife, to such an extent that it will either bring the construction industry in general to it's knees or force regualtion, which do you think the government will allow?

All this cheap foreign labour enables all the property developers and buy-to-let landlords to do up their places on the cheap, so surely the middle classes benefit directly from this? I don't think the government will make any changes in a hurry, think of all that capital gains tax/stamp duty they're raking in, probably much more than they could get from taxing Polish builders who are on £200 a week. In that respect they are good for our economy.