'Should the UK join the Euro?' poll discussion

Saucepot

Bring back the grote !

KevinH1980

No! Aside from the implications to the cost of living, the £ is part of our btitish identity

[Deleted User]

KevinH1980 wrote: »

No! Aside from the implications to the cost of living, the £ is part of our btitish identity

Thanks Kevin, but... I really don't get this "part of our British identity" thing. It seems to me a strange kind of "identity" that is contingent upon the kind of notes and coins one carries in one's wallet...! Cost of conversion, potential for short-term inflation, loss of a not-insignificant lever of economic management and the consequent risks of being saddled with an incompatible interest rate, all those I can understand as arguments against, but identity? Really?

M_Thomson

Marvin_the_Martian wrote: »

Thanks Kevin, but... I really don't get this "part of our British identity" thing. It seems to me a strange kind of "identity" that is contingent upon the kind of notes and coins one carries in one's wallet...! Cost of conversion, potential for short-term inflation, loss of a not-insignificant lever of economic management and the consequent risks of being saddled with an incompatible interest rate, all those I can understand as arguments against, but identity? Really?

I am Marvin of Borg, resistance is futile. :rolleyes:

M_Thomson

RogerBruton wrote: »

Why not just go for it?!?! Join the euro! If you don't like the sound of it just call them "pounds"! They are worth about the same anyway!!

Are you British? If so, I worry that you would be allowed a vote in a referendum after making a statement like that.

[Deleted User]

M_Thomson wrote: »

I am Marvin of Borg, resistance is futile. :rolleyes:

What, because I don't buy the irrational line that the currency we carry in our wallet is an integral part of our identity? Do me a favour.

bigheadxx

Marvin_the_Martian wrote: »

What, because I don't buy the irrational line that the currency we carry in our wallet is an integral part of our identity? Do me a favour.

How many other countries in the world can legitimately say that they are "proud" of their currency?

USA and Germany and France prior to the Euro. It is something that makes us uniquely who we are and I see no valid argument for abandoning it.

The £ means something around the world and is still a peg for many other currencies.

[Deleted User]

bigheadxx wrote: »

How many other countries in the world can legitimately say that they are "proud" of their currency?

USA and Germany and France prior to the Euro. It is something that makes us uniquely who we are and I see no valid argument for abandoning it.

You're the second person who's asserted that it is somehow an integral part of our British identity, but I still fail to see the basis for such an assertion. How is it "something that makes us uniquely who we are"?

The £ means something around the world and is still a peg for many other currencies.

What other currencies? The Sterling Area ended in the 1970s, and as far as I know, the only countries with currencies that remain pegged to the Pound are the Falkland Islands, Saint Helena, Gibraltar and a few other islands of little to no economic significance.

It would be fair to say that it has been increasingly used as a reserve currency - perhaps that is what you meant - but it's also worth noting that this is in large part because it is seen as a proxy for the euro, according to some analysts. And the Pound has lost something like 25% of its value against the euro in the last couple of years, and its status as a reserve currency also appears to have suffered as a result (it accounted for 4.1% of foreign exchange reserves in 2008, down from its peak of 4.7% in 2007; no figures are available for 2009 as yet, obviously).

As far as arguments for joining the euro are concerned, its proponents state that we would gain greater exchange stability (the euro is the second largest global reserve currency, and may be on course to become the largest later this century, especially if we were to join it) and interest rates would be less volatile (as evidenced by the data we do have, since 1999 the peaks and troughs of interest rates in the UK have been more pronounced than in the Eurozone), and that it would also enhance price transparency across the Single Market.

As far as arguments against joining the euro are concerned, I've touched on them briefly in previous posts.

However, I simply do not understand the assertion that "it's part of our identity" is one of them. I do find it a bit odd, and lamentable, that because I dare to question this one assertion, this idolatry of a currency, that I get the lazy epithet "Marvin of Borg" thrown at me. I have done my best to provide a balanced assessment of the situation, and as such, such remarks don't do justice to any reasonable discussion.

PolishBigSpender

bigheadxx wrote: »

The £ means something around the world and is still a peg for many other currencies.

No, the US Dollar and the Euro mean something. The Pound is an interesting thing to dabble in and perhaps hold some small holdings, but it's certainly nothing compared to the might of the US Dollar and the Euro.

The Pound was always (post WW2) inferior to the Deutschmark - just look at the amount of currencies within Europe itself which tied to the DM rather than the Pound. And of course, the ERM was based upon a peg to the DM - not the Pound!

If the Pound was so strong historically, why do Montenegro and Kosovo use Euro, and equally so - why did Estonia and Bosnia tie their currencies to the DM rather than Pound? Even the Austrian Schilling was tied to the DM - as was the Bulgarian Lev.

In fact, as far as I can tell - no independent country has pegged their currency to the Pound, or uses it as their de facto currency. Compare this to the Euro (off the top of my head!) -

Vatican City
Monaco
Kosovo
Bosnia
Montenegro
Estonia
Latvia
Lithuania
Denmark
Andorra
San Marino
Bulgaria

And that's just in Europe alone!

I can understand the sentimental reasons behind keeping the Pound (I'm exactly the same with the Zloty) - but at the end of the day, economically, it makes much more sense to have a unified currency in a unified trading bloc than to maintain seperate currencies. The cost to British businesses is significant.

M_Thomson

PolishBigSpender wrote: »

No, the US Dollar and the Euro mean something. The Pound is an interesting thing to dabble in and perhaps hold some small holdings, but it's certainly nothing compared to the might of the US Dollar and the Euro.

The Pound was always (post WW2) inferior to the Deutschmark - just look at the amount of currencies within Europe itself which tied to the DM rather than the Pound. And of course, the ERM was based upon a peg to the DM - not the Pound!

If the Pound was so strong historically, why do Montenegro and Kosovo use Euro, and equally so - why did Estonia and Bosnia tie their currencies to the DM rather than Pound? Even the Austrian Schilling was tied to the DM - as was the Bulgarian Lev.

In fact, as far as I can tell - no independent country has pegged their currency to the Pound, or uses it as their de facto currency. Compare this to the Euro (off the top of my head!) -

Vatican City
Monaco
Kosovo
Bosnia
Montenegro
Estonia
Latvia
Lithuania
Denmark
Andorra
San Marino
Bulgaria

And that's just in Europe alone!

I can understand the sentimental reasons behind keeping the Pound (I'm exactly the same with the Zloty) - but at the end of the day, economically, it makes much more sense to have a unified currency in a unified trading bloc than to maintain seperate currencies. The cost to British businesses is significant.

Without wishing to sound rude, you can hardly compare the pound which is the 4th largest reserve currency in the world to the Zloty. What makes sense for any proud independent country is to have your own currency, and the right to self govern yourselves in all ways. Which is why the EU and the Euro will eventually fail. You may consider the Euro right for Poland, but it isn't right for Britain. From that way that this recession is going, the one size fits all isn't right for a lot of the Eurozone either.