Urgent request for advice, please!

Shinysprite

Sorry, bit of a long post but just want to make sure all info's included... here goes:

Shinysprite wrote: »

Hi all,

I posted a couple of months back on another thread about my situation:

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.html?p=22022669&highlight=shinysprite#post22022669

But, to sum it up, I have three creditors, totalling debt of around £14,000 between them. I have no job, but some savings, which I would like (and have been advised) to realise in order to make reduced full and final settlement offers to them.

Requested CCAs from them at the end of May and have received mixed responses. Just wondering if anyone can advise on next steps?

1 - HFC Bank. Sent me by recorded delivery, on day 12 after my request, NOT a copy of my CCA, but a statement of my account, accompanied by a letter which says:

'HFC Bank has been unable to provide a photocopy of your original agreement. However, please note that in accordance with Regulation 3 of the Consumer Credit (Cancellation Notices and Copies of Documents) Regulations 1983 we provide a copy of the executed agreement that does not include information which it is permitted to exclude such as the signatures and signature box. Upon the original agreement becoming available, HFC Bank will forward this to you as soon as it is received. (NOT HOLDING MY BREATH FOR THAT! :rolleyes: )

Whilst monthly payments to your account have been maintained in line with the terms and conditions, the payments that have been received have been submitted by you and it is reasonable to conclude that you acknowledge this debt. In summary, our records confirm that you have conducted the above account in a way which suggests you have a relationship with the bank. In view of this, HFC Bank holds you liable for the outstanding balance on the above account.

I trust the information I have provided to you is to your satisfaction but should you require anything further.... etc..'

I've since spoken to them and made a couple of token payments and told them that I hope to be in a position to make a f&f settlement offer shortly (no mention of savings - have said that a relative may be willing to lend me some money to help me out) and they seem fairly happy with the situation - although I am not sure how much I should offer. 50%?

2 - Egg - Received a copy of my signed CCA (some time after 12+2) but I'm not sure if it contains all required information and they have not chased me for any payments since I told them in May of my change in circumstances and that I could not keep up my regular monthly payments, so I'm not sure how to deal with them. Again, I'd like to make them an offer but not sure how much.

3 - This is the most interesting case. CL Finance - Have not received any response from them WHATSOEVER following my CCA request. Nothing requesting payment or anything until TODAY, when I received a letter in which they say:

'We refer to the above account and note that you have failed to make the agreed payments towards the concessionary arrangement on your account.

To allow the arrangement to continue, you must make an immediate payment of £xx.xx to reach us within 10 days of the date of this letter. You must continue to make all subsequent payments, as originally agreed as a condition of the concessionary arrangement. If your payment is not received, the arrangement will be cancelled and further action will be taken to recover the full balance.

Please treat this letter as formal notification that if you do not make the agreed payment, we will instruct our solicitors or a debt recovery agency to take further recovery action against you. This may include the issue of legal proceedings without further warning.'

I know there's not much they can do, given that they haven't provided me with a CCA, and I have also made them aware of my circumstances, i.e., that I am on JSA and unable for the time being to make repayments at my previously agreed rate. When I informed them of this, as soon as it happened, they were fine with it and agreed to hold the account until they heard from me. When they did hear from me, i.e., my CCA request, they obviously chose to ignore me.

Soooo - my question is, what happens now? Do I tell CL Finance that their debt is unenforceable and make a much-reduced offer of f&f settlement?

I've checked my Experian report and most of my defaults are due to expire next year and my credit rating is steadily improving, so I obviously want to avoid more problems in this area!

Any advice much appreciated!! xx

I sent a letter to CL Finance over three weeks ago telling them that I'd requested a CCA, that they had not responded within 12 + 2 or 30 days, and that as a result, they were in default and the debt was unenforceable. I told them I would report them to the relevant authorities if they continued to chase this debt while in default.

I have heard NOTHING from them, until today, when I received court papers - they intend to take me to court to claim over £7,000. I have 14 days to respond to the claim, either by admitting it and paying in full, admitting it and asking for more time, or defending it, by telling the court that I had requested a CCA and that CL failed to provide me with any of the requested doumentation.

Is there anyone out there who might be able to advise me on my best course of action? I don't want to just roll over and pay it but equally don't want another CCJ as I've had one before which was settled two and a half years ago and my credit score has been improving since then. And I don't want to let them get away with not fulfilling their legal obligation to provide me with documentation to which I am legally entitled!

Help...!!!

ladybez

I am no legal expert and I'm sure someone with more knowledge than me will be along soon. One suggestion is contact the CAB for advise. Keep posting and let us know how you go on..

thefoolonthehill

Hi

Can they take you to court whilst you are in dispute? I didnt think they could do this. Did you send the letter recorded delivery?

Aytoun27

Hi,

My advice is to tread carefully with this one. Strictly speaking you’re absolutely right that you’re legally entitled to the documents and that the debts became unenforceable without them.

But there’s no guarantee that a judge will accept this as a valid reason for you not to repay the money you owe. My partner and I were in a similar situation last year and not only did the FOS fail to uphold our complaint, but they advised us (in writing) that if we took the matter to court the judgement was likely to go against us. :mad:

This, we understood, was because the courts (like the FOS) have little sympathy with people who are trying to use legal technicalities to get out of paying back debts (their opinion, not mine before anyone jumps on me). Our local CAB also agreed with this line of reasoning. It’s seen as ‘won’t pay’ rather than as ‘can’t pay’.

Anyway, I just wanted to warn you of the possible risks, of course you may be lucky and get a judge who finds in your favour, but don’t go in there thinking that you’re bound to win just because the company haven’t provided an agreement. Sadly, it doesn’t work that way, it should, but it doesn’t.

Shinysprite

thefoolonthehill wrote: »

Hi

Can they take you to court whilst you are in dispute? I didnt think they could do this. Did you send the letter recorded delivery?

Yes, I did send the letter recorded delivery, I have proof of posting and proof that they received it. I also didn't think they could take me to court while in dispute, I think they are trying to call my bluff and while I really want to see this through (there's a principle at stake!), I'm still a bit scared of the whole court procedure...!

Shinysprite

Thanks, Aytoun27, that's interesting. Will try to see the CAB on Monday, but do you think it's also useful to talk to the FOS and get some advice? Thing is, even if the judgement goes against me, CL Finance are in no better a position than they were as I will only either be making smaller instalment payments or looking for a much reduced settlement figure.

Ames

I think you need advice from the people who know most about CCA's and court, I'm sure there are people on here who have successfully defended a court case. Maybe if you change your title to something like 'no cca, taken to court' that'll get the right people's attention. Consumer Action Group is also a good place to get advice on this, they're the real legal eagles.