should erps be banned?

TroJon

ninky wrote: »

how have they lost out?! they could a) simply repay their debt with the repaid debt you would have given them b) offer to match the rate of the new lender (they still make money) c) not lend out money they don't actually have in the first place (slightly radical concept for most i realise).

I'm not even going to reply properly to this, because you clearly have almost zero understanding of the financial sector, yet you are incredibly critical because you do not want to pay for a benefit.

The money they have lent to you has actually cost them money. Pure and simple, they have borrowed money from savers and paid them interest. In giving you that money, it has cost them several percent interest. In charging you interest, they re-coup that loss. In matching the rate of the new lender they do not "still make money" as the market fluctuates lol, you can't just presume that because you had to pay more back then, it cost them the same as it will now. That's the whole reason there are fluctuating stocks, and libor rates, exchange rates etc. etc.

I think you need to learn the very basics of money, cash, financial products etc.

ILW

I think you will wind that in the 1930s there was a much greater spread of wages than now. (Ignoring the extremes). At that time "workers" would never had had any channce of buying on of these nice semis. Whereas now, many are being bought but people in such professions as plumbers, carpenters etc. The good old days wern't that great if you were not middle class.

SandC

ninky wrote: »

we're talking 1930 not 1930s. and even semi's are relatively large when you look at typical properties today.

link to average wages here
http://www.statistics.gov.uk/cci/nugget.asp?id=285

....plus the weekly wage doesn't take into account the fact it might not be a permanent job and therefore won't translate into annual income.

http://www.housepricecrash.co.uk/indices-rightmove-national.php

Average house prices.

You are using a national average wage - okay it is £25k. So you must therefore use a national house price average.

In 1930 many thousands of properties were terraces of the 2 up, 2 down variety - not made in 1930 but of the type made from the mid 1800s to the earlier part of the century. I suggest that those who bought a semi or detached in 1930 were on more than the national average wage at the time just as they are today and pretty much always have been.

ninky_2

TroJon wrote: »

I'm not even going to reply properly to this, because you clearly have almost zero understanding of the financial sector, yet you are incredibly critical because you do not want to pay for a benefit.

The money they have lent to you has actually cost them money. Pure and simple, they have borrowed money from savers and paid them interest. .

actually i am not "paying for a benefit" because i rightly don't see the benefit of being tied in with erps.

as for having zero understanding of the financial sector.....banks do not simply lend out money that has been deposited in savings. if this was the case the amount of money in circulation would stay the same. it clearly doesn't. therefore, they lend out money that has been artificially created by the fact someone is going to take out a debt. for the system to sustain there must always be more and more money (or more and more debt). like the pyramid scheme it is it is clearly unsustainable (although govts have tried to buy it time with QE etc etc).

maybe it is you who needs to find out about how our economy works?

http://gaianeconomics.blogspot.com/2007/01/where-does-money-come-from.html

ILW

I think Ninky has just got the hump because he can only afford a 1 bed flat and is trying to blame anyone and everyone for it.

ninky_2

ILW wrote: »

I think Ninky has just got the hump because he can only afford a 1 bed flat and is trying to blame anyone and everyone for it.

not at all. i consider myself relatively lucky in the world as i have quite a healthy income and can afford to do things i like such as owning a boat and going on holiday. i'm not motivated so much from self interest as in concern for the system and others less fortunate. (yes that is possible).

it's she btw.

ninky_2

SandC wrote: »

http://www.housepricecrash.co.uk/indices-rightmove-national.php

Average house prices.

You are using a national average wage - okay it is £25k. So you must therefore use a national house price average.

In 1930 many thousands of properties were terraces of the 2 up, 2 down variety - not made in 1930 but of the type made from the mid 1800s to the earlier part of the century. I suggest that those who bought a semi or detached in 1930 were on more than the national average wage at the time just as they are today and pretty much always have been.

yes and they weren't owned as much as rented - remember only 30 percent of the population actually OWNED their home. this would have been the 30 percent of bigger homes (else who was owning them? there was no mortgage lending).

ILW

ninky wrote: »

not at all. i consider myself relatively lucky in the world as i have quite a healthy income and can afford to do things i like such as owning a boat and going on holiday. i'm not motivated so much from self interest as in concern for the system and others less fortunate. (yes that is possible).

it's she btw.

Home ownership and standard of living is now higher than it has ever been in this country, so things cannot be working out too bad.

Wakey2008

ninky wrote: »

:rotfl:i thought income multiples were based on annual income not weekly?! even assuming you are right about the average income that's £104 a year = 5.7 times income (or there abouts) to buy a property (large house) outright. where do they train mortgage advisers these days?

btw the average wage is not £600 a week.

The principle is still the same. Now you are arguing with at least 8 people on here and each are telling you are wrong.

Maybe you need to go in a corner somewhere and consider why this is.

With your poor grammar you are in no position to question where anyone trained or did anything as you can't even grasp where full stops and capital letters should go when you write sentences. :rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

You keep arguing how much greater it was in 1930 and then admit that most couldn't afford to own.

What do you suggest? Nobody owns and everyone goes back to living in two up, two down terraces without running water and an outside toilet at the end of the street like something out of Road To Wigan Pier? Do you want to have to bathe in a tin bath in front of your children in the living room? Next you'll be saying that washing machines and spin driers are a rip off because you can wash your clothes in the kitchen sink and use a perfectly good mangle.

What an idiot.:cool::p

SandC

Some of the following is quite interesting:

http://www.pre-war-housing.org.uk/default.htm

if you have time to flick through it.