Charging Order? The myth

eggbox

jmsc3511

The date the agreement was signed will let you know what CCA would be in place and if around 10 years ago it will be the CCA 2006 (which came into force in April 2007.) If any of the debts were CCA regulated then statutory interest is not allowed. Only contractual interest can be added which means there must be a term in the original agreement that interest will be added to any defaulted debt but this is rare. So in the first instance you will need to discover which interest is being charged?

With regard to the restrictions removal, unless you sell the house it will only be removed if you pay off the debt. But hopefully Land Registry Rep will provide details of how to go about things regarding the transfer?

Land_Registry

jmsc3511 said:

Hello - Can you help me with my some advice re paying off debts that are secured on my house in order to do a transfer of equity. In summary there are two form K restrictions from my ex-H's debts which I'm aware I don't have to pay when I sell the house (but he is still liable for the debt). As part of our divorce I have a consent order giving me the beneficial interest in the property, but he is still on the title deeds (as neither of us could pay off those debts then in order to do the title transfer). In order to do a transfer of equity now I understand that would have to pay off those debts.

Your post is really aimed at the debt and how much is now owed for example. 

The key thing to comment on re the registered title / form K restriction is that any transfer (an example of a disposition) can only be registered if the restriction is complied with. 

As eggbox and this thread helps to explain overreaching can occur in a very specific scenario which results in a form K being automatically cancelled. 

A form K restriction, once the requirement for a certificate is complied with, can be automatically cancelled on the registration of a transfer of the registered estate for valuable consideration. 

I assume therefore that your transfer doesn’t fit that scenario probably because of the consent order/equity involved 

mainstand

Hi, I wonder if anybody can help. I .will be as concise as possible
Around 2010 my wife and I got into lots of credit card debt, this resulted in CCJ's and 4 second charges taken out on out property. I have checked the report from Land Registry. I can see these listed as "Interim" charging orders, showing as "restrictions". My assumption was that these debts would be settled if and when the property has been sold. I cannot see any reference to final charging orders.
At no stage were we asked to make any repayments. However, I am now receiving letters from Mortimore Clark solicitors pertaining to one of the debts, acting on behalf of Cabot who I assume bought the debt from HSBC. They are asking for income / expenditure, which I have not done.
My questions.
1) Do I need to complete this form after all this time? I am now retired, and have very little disposable income.
2) 2 of the charging orders are against my wife only. My wife passed away  10 years ago. Am I responsible for these debts? 

There is still a main mortgage on the property, which is up to date. This has never been in arrears. Also the CCJ's no longer appear on my credit file.

Thanks for listening, any advise and guidance would be appreciated. I cannot understand why no final charging orders were made.

eggbox

mainstand

Firstly, for the purposes of registering a restriction on a debtors property, then an interim Charging Order does the same job as a final charging order. Many creditors don't, therefore, follow up to the final CO stage as it saves them time and expense, not doing so, as they already have what they want.

But could I just ask you to clarify if any of the debts were jointly owned and was the one Mortimer Clarke are dealing with one of them? Given your circumstances of being retired with very little disposable income, you have nothing to worry about as nothing is going to happed. However, if you can clarify the "joint" debts situation it will help explain what's what?

mainstand

Hi Eggbox, thanks for the reply. I will list the 2nd charges

DG Solicitors (HSBC) In the name of my late wife only
Nationwide  In the name of my late wife only
Reston Solicitors (on behalf of HFC) in my name only
Mortimer Clarke Solicitors (Cabot) in my name only

I have not been contacted by the first 3, so the restrictions are just sat there.

With Mortimer Clarke, I get constant letters and phone calls. They simply state that I have a ccj against me, and I need to fill in a income / expenditure form to send back to them. Saying now that my account has been passed to litigation. (not sure what this means) They make no mention that there is a 2nd charge, only that I have a ccj.

I have never been ordered to enter into a repayment plan on any of the ccj's. So my assumption was that the 2nd charges would simply be settled on selling the property in the future.

I assume that the debts against my wife will still need to be settled eventually, even though she passed away 10 years ago

Thanks again for your help, appreciated

eggbox

mainstand

You have to realise that most of the staff employed by DCA's aren't, shall we say, the brightest of minds as they are indoctrinated to believe any one who owes money is filthy scum. So don't get intimidated by them and the next time they ring explain you no longer wish to receive phone calls (as they are too stressful) and will only respond in writing.

Saying they are passing the matter to litigation is an attempt to make you think they are going to do bad things to you through Court. They obviously don't understand the matter has already been sorted with a CO so it may be worth just mentioning that to them, if they do call again, or if you decide to write to them? But you are under no legal obligation to provide an I&E form so ignore that.

Whilst a creditor can still try to enforce a debt after being granted a Court order, they are well and truly shafted in your particular case. This is because the only other methods, really, left open to them are (i) an attachment of earnings order (which is of no use as you're retired) and (ii) an order for sale by requesting a Court to order you to sell your house to pay the debt. However, this is also a non starter as no Judge is ever going to throw a retired person out of their  home for a debt the creditor has only paid around 10% of the face value for (Mortimer Clarke will know this which is why they don't try.)

So my advice is just to ignore them as they only keep ringing you as you're only encouraging them as you keep picking the phone. That's not a criticism it's just a fact. So the sooner you ignore them the quicker they will get fed up amd move on to easier prey.
  

mainstand

Many thanks Eggbox, I feel a lot better now. I take no pleasure from having debts, embarrassed by it to be truthful, and would gladly pay what I owe if I had the funds. But I haven't. so they will have to wait.
So I will just enjoy my retirement
Thanks again

liddlewill

Hi guys, not sure if this is the right place to post as im in a bit of a whirl with what my father has "dropped" on us. Dad had a stroke/heart attack about 2 years ago and hasnt been the same since, he rarely remembers old stuff but called me yesterday to come look at his house deeds. There is a name on the deeds he sort of rememebers from the early 80s. Turns out he was drunk driving (twice...) but the second time he hit another car, in a new car he had just taken hp on. Nobody was allowed to court with him, we dont know why.
 But it appears he couldnt pay the debt/compensation to the person he hit. So his name was put on the deeds to dads (and mums without her permission) house. He also claims he was fined, but couldnt pay, so agreed some terms with that too, but thats not mentioned on the deeds from what i can see (not sure where to look for this) . Now he thinks hes going to die, and lumber mum with a huge debt, so hes trying to tidy it up. I have no idea where to start, or what to look for, mum just keeps asking why she wasnt allowed to court (bless her) and dad just keeps saying it needs to be sorted.
 Sorry if this is the wrong place
 Any help is greatly appreciated
 Will

Land_Registry

liddlewill said:

Hi guys, not sure if this is the right place to post as im in a bit of a whirl with what my father has "dropped" on us. Dad had a stroke/heart attack about 2 years ago and hasnt been the same since, he rarely remembers old stuff but called me yesterday to come look at his house deeds. There is a name on the deeds he sort of rememebers from the early 80s. Turns out he was drunk driving (twice...) but the second time he hit another car, in a new car he had just taken hp on. Nobody was allowed to court with him, we dont know why.
 But it appears he couldnt pay the debt/compensation to the person he hit. So his name was put on the deeds to dads (and mums without her permission) house. He also claims he was fined, but couldnt pay, so agreed some terms with that too, but thats not mentioned on the deeds from what i can see (not sure where to look for this) . Now he thinks hes going to die, and lumber mum with a huge debt, so hes trying to tidy it up. I have no idea where to start, or what to look for, mum just keeps asking why she wasnt allowed to court (bless her) and dad just keeps saying it needs to be sorted.
 Sorry if this is the wrong place
 Any help is greatly appreciated
 Will

It reads like something other than a charging order/form K restriction so may be worth DM me with title number so I can take a look and reply 

stillkicking

Hi, I would like some advice on this please. As I have been getting a lot of different advice on what must be done to sell the property.

19.11.2012) RESTRICTION: No disposition of the registered estate, other than a disposition by the proprietor of any registered charge registered before the entry of this restriction, is to be registered without a certificate signed by the applicant for registration or their conveyancer that written notice of the disposition was given to xxx, being the person with the benefit of an Interim charging order on the beneficial interest of ??? made by the Manchester County Court on 7 November 2012

Is this a form K? As it is my name only and the property is jointly owned.

Is timing of the essence when dealing with something like this or can the company be notified at the beginning of the process due to lead times with the land registry, for notifying the buyers solicitor of the property showing it has been removed / complied with. Or is it best to wait until  to last minute? 

Also can anyone recommend a conveyancing solicitor who understands this? 

Also can the same solicitor work for both parties on selling / buying a house?

Thanks