Can the judge refuse bankruptcy?

wayforward_2

I am doing my statement of earnings and because we are already paying into a DMP and also because our outgoings will decrease by £300 as we lease a car that will go when we go BR - our suprlus looks to be about £700 per month. I completely understand that we will have an IPA (hopefully for about the same £400 as our payplan payments) for 3 years but am now worried that the judge will look at the SOA and refuse to grant bankruptcy because we are managing out debt (albeit through the DMP). The reason for the bankruptcy is that our DMP is estimated to last a min of 15 years!

tigerfeet2006

If you have taken professional advice and BR has been suggested then a Judge will generally not refuse BR. I have seen other people with that sort of surplus go BR so don't worry.

Make sure you put your SoA up on here before submitting it, to be checked.

http://www.makesenseofcards.co.uk/soacalc.html

wayforward_2

Thank you! Have just spoken to Insolvency Helpline who agreed that we are insolvent but that a judge may well refuse to grant BR due to our high surplus - she suggested trying it though as the worst thing that can happen is that he will refuse and we carry on with the DMP. (Obviously this will have cost us £1000 though!)

Monthly Budget Summary Amount(£)
Total monthly income 3,965
Monthly expenses (incl. HP & secured loans) 3,267
Available for debt repayments 698
UNsecured debt repayments 373 - this is what we pay to Payplan
Amount left after debt repayments 325

Personal Balance Sheet Summary Amount(£)
Total Assets (things you own) 336,500
Total Secured & HP Debt -348,000
Total Unsecured Debt -63,009
Net Assets -74,509

Household Information
Number of adults in household 2
Number of children in household 2
Number of cars owned 1

Income, Expense, Debt & Asset Details
Income Amount(£)
Monthly income after tax 1500 - this is variable as I am part employed and part self employed
Partners monthly income 2100
Benefits 145
Other income 220
Total monthly income 3965

Expenses Amount(£)
Mortgage 1080
Secured/HP loan payments 0
Rent 0
Management charge (leasehold property) 0
Council tax 176
Electricity 44
Gas 107
Oil 0
Water Rates 48
Telephone (land line) 30 - have to have second line for part time self employment
Mobile phone 60 - these are three phones (daughter, husband and me)
TV Licence 12
Satellite/Cable TV 40
Internet services 5 - have to have for self employment
Groceries etc. 500 - this includes school dinners
Clothing 100
Petrol/diesel 150 - have to have for children transportation
Road tax 16
Car Insurance 47 - this includes breakdown cover
Car maintenance (including MOT) 50
Car Parking 12
Other travel 295 - train for husband and 2 children
Childcare/nursery 0
Other child related expenses 0
Medical (prescriptions, dentists, opticians etc.) 50 - both OH and I have ongoing medication
Pet Insurance/Vet bills 56
Buildings Insurance 22
Contents Insurance 0
Life Assurance 14
Other Insurance 33
Presents (birthday, christmas etc.) 50
Haircuts 50
Entertainment 0
Holiday 100
Emergency Fund 100
Pets 20
Total monthly expenses 3267

tigerfeet2006

wayforward wrote: »

Thank you! Have just spoken to Insolvency Helpline who agreed that we are insolvent but that a judge may well refuse to grant BR due to our high surplus - she suggested trying it though as the worst thing that can happen is that he will refuse and we carry on with the DMP. (Obviously this will have cost us £1000 though!)

You need to produce 2 SoA's.Yours will have the joint household expenditure on it and your own personal bills ie travel, mobile. You then put your full wage and your OH's contribution to the JOINT household bills. Your OH does the same. Hope that makes sense.

Monthly Budget Summary Amount(£)
Total monthly income 3,965
Monthly expenses (incl. HP & secured loans) 3,267
Available for debt repayments 698
UNsecured debt repayments 373 - this is what we pay to Payplan
Amount left after debt repayments 325

Personal Balance Sheet Summary Amount(£)
Total Assets (things you own) 336,500
Total Secured & HP Debt -348,000
Total Unsecured Debt -63,009
Net Assets -74,509

Household Information
Number of adults in household 2
Number of children in household 2
Number of cars owned 1

Income, Expense, Debt & Asset Details
Income Amount(£)
Monthly income after tax 1500 - this is variable as I am part employed and part self employed
Partners monthly income 2100
Benefits 145
Other income 220
Total monthly income 3965

Expenses Amount(£)
Mortgage 1080
Secured/HP loan payments 0
Rent 0
Management charge (leasehold property) 0
Council tax 176
Electricity 44
Gas 107
Oil 0
Water Rates 48
Telephone (land line) 30 - have to have second line for part time self employment
Put this at £60
Mobile phone 60 - these are three phones (daughter, husband and me) Usually max |£60 for all phones but try slipping in £20 on each SoA
TV Licence 12
Satellite/Cable TV 40 not allowed on SoA to come from surplus
Internet services 5 - have to have for self employment
Groceries etc. 500 - this includes school dinners £600 with out school dinners
Clothing 100 £120
Petrol/diesel 150 - have to have for children transportation
Road tax 16
Car Insurance 47 - this includes breakdown cover
Car maintenance (including MOT) 50
Car Parking 12
Other travel 295 - train for husband and 2 children
Childcare/nursery 0
Other child related expenses 0 £5 per child per week activities.£2 per day junior £3 secondary school dinners
Medical (prescriptions, dentists, opticians etc.) 50 - both OH and I have ongoing medication look at getting a pre payment certificate. £20 each
Pet Insurance/Vet bills 56 £20
Buildings Insurance 22 does this include contents with acc. damage?
Contents Insurance 0
Life Assurance 14
Other Insurance 33 what is this?
Presents (birthday, christmas etc.) 50 most OR's won't allow. could try £20
Haircuts 50 £10 adult £5 kid
Entertainment 0
Holiday 100 £80
Emergency Fund 100 definatly not allowed. try £20 and see.
Pets 20 £0
Total monthly expenses 3267

Hope that gives you some ideas

tigerfeet2006

Just had a thought any business expenses such as the phone needs to come off your SE income before you get a true figure for SE wage, does that make sense?

Your life insurance you will most likely have to buy the beneficial interest back from the OR.

wayforward_2

Yes i get you - have taken that into account. Have just come back from the accountant Was going to at least try to preserve the company name for future use if possible but it seems that the Ltd company is also insolvent and we should add the £3k corporation tax bill to our debts.

I have tried and tried for so many years to be sensible, find a way out of all this and i am now so so scared that the judge will not allow the BR. Only thing holding us up now is OH has to sell his motorbike and book a retraining course with the money otherwise the OR will treat as an asset. He has to retrain as his industry is pretty dead and redundancy within 3 years is likely.

tigerfeet2006

Sorry to hear that Wayforward, but at least you know the full story and can make your way forward now.

Will this mean that you won't have the SE part of your income now?

wayforward_2

No I'll still have the SE portion - will just show it as SE earnings rather than putting it through the LTD co - which tbh has been an expensive way of doing it anyway!

hostman

How the frack have you got into this situation in the first place, with an income of £3,965!

wayforward_2

We may have that income now but in the last 2.5 yrs OH was redundant for 18 months and had a brain haemorrhage. In lots of ways we are very lucky but unfortunately these huge debts are a legacy of that time and the subsequent necessary house move.

wayforward_2

Ok have redone the SOA - did you mean to put 100% of the household expenses on mine and then my OH's contribution (theoretical as our money is joint) towards them or should i put 50% of the household expenses on each of our SOA's?