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Are you ready for the crash 2009-2013?
Comments
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Because you remain in employment, in pretty average jobs... when the economy is being sucked into the deflationary vortex.
My comment of 'pretty average jobs' was just a turn of phrase, meaning that neither of us are on massive salaries. However, we have no kids, are both pretty young and earn around £70k a year between us. I would say our jobs our quite safe (yeah, yeah, I know, "none are safe".) We're pretty comfortable and I don't have any real worries about a 'deflationary vortex', whatever that is.How did that chat with your Dad go? "Yeah, we have 2 properties now Dad... one on the market. Got a lot of interest in it. Just got to sell before values collapse, and be one of the lucky ones to escape with a high price despite such low transaction levels.
Erm, not really, as people in the real world don't talk like that. The chat went along the lines that we never intended to be landlords, we wanted to check that we could settle in a new area, where only one of us had a job (and that was fixed term). We also discussed the fact that although we were selling at a loss, we'd been quite sensible with money and could take the hit. Remember that most people don't think values will 'collapse', including myself. I think another 5 - 10% off prices and a few years of stagnation.
We sold the property by the way, so it isn't on the market any more. Subject to exchange of contract of course.Yeah current market conditions totally warrant people like us taking 3 foreign holidays a year whilst the economy is tanking."
"people like us". You can almost hear the contempt dripping from your keyboard.
This is where our viewpoints probably contrast completely. Yes, at the moment we have enough money for three holidays a year. We budget very, very carefully and for seven years we've saved one of our incomes, either as cash or to pay off our mortgage. We'll probably continue to always do this. In addition, we have a separate budget for holidays, as we enjoy travel. I pretty much aim to have three holidays a year from now until I get too old to do so. Why is this an issue for you? What is the real reason this bothers you so much?
If, for example, you really enjoyed a hobby of racing cars, I wouldn't begrudge you the pleasure. If you lived carefully, and saved half your money to run a racing season because you loved it, then I think that's great. Enjoy yourself. There's a million other examples of course, but the basic message is the same: if you can budget and still enjoy life, then surely that's the main aim of having money?
The real pessimists on this forum (and I'm not talking about the majority of bears / pessimists on here, who take a cautious view but are still quite clearly in the real world) assume that everyone else is an idiot. That you're incapable of being sensible, of having a budget, and yet can still enjoy life with whatever else floats your boat: whether that's a nice car, holidays, a hobby etc. It is possible you know.
I think it's a cheap shot when people talk about others being jealous, but I do sometimes wonder...Hope you've got some cash savings reserves and aren't spending as fast as you're earning it - circumstances can change pretty fast.
Yes, as above, we've saved one income for around seven years now, so we save around 35% to 45% of net income every single month. Because we're not idiots. I know that to fit your view we would be taking out loans against our house to fund exotic holidays, but we're not.
Would you prefer it if we were?0 -
My comment of 'pretty average jobs' was just a turn of phrase, meaning that neither of us are on massive salaries. However, we have no kids, are both pretty young and earn around £70k a year between us. I would say our jobs our quite safe (yeah, yeah, I know, "none are safe".)
OK Cleaver. Good response, thank you. I've nothing against anyone taking foreign holidays, providing they can genuinely afford them, when measured against all other circumstances.
The parent-conversation was a trigger. Can imagine many people discussing how the wealth of their generation allows them to take multiple-foreign-holidays, and who are now on the brink."Why is this an issue for you? What is the real reason this bothers you so much?
Also because I know too many other people from so many different age-groups, who are still taking many foreign holidays despite being in, or approaching negative equity - and with their jobs on the line or incomes set to fall, and their homes, BTLs crashing in value too.
If you're enjoying that lifestyle without over-stretching yourself, with a financial cushion to meet change of circumstances (and you could probably get by and adapt comfortably if both your incomes fell, or lost one income) and not over-leveraged elsewhere, then that is fine.
Enjoy your holidays and the rewards from your work in a balanced way, but nothing wrong with my feeling contempt towards those who spent recklessly, and are still spending recklessly... whilst on the brink of financial wipeout.0 -
OK Cleaver. Good response, thank you. I've nothing against anyone taking foreign holidays, providing they can genuinely afford them, when measured against all other circumstances.
No probs, always enjoy a good debate with you Mr Dopester.The parent-conversation was a trigger. Can imagine many people discussing how the wealth of their generation allows them to take multiple-foreign-holidays, and who are now on the brink.
Also because I know too many other people from so many different age-groups, who are still taking many foreign holidays despite being in, or approaching negative equity - and with their jobs on the line or incomes set to fall, and their homes, BTLs crashing in value too.
As I say though, maybe this is where you and I have really different views. I have no doubt there are some, perhaps a significant minority, who are being reckless, stupid and planless (is that a word?) when it comes to their money and finance. But in my office (which has people from all backgrounds, ages, views and cultures and tends to be a good general yardstick of society) people seem to sense the seriousness of the situation we're in and are acting accordingly. Although many may not have seen any wage reduction or change in circumstances, they are adjusting accordingly. Big and small things - bringing in their own lunches, thinking more carefully about that car purchase or holiday, cutting back on clothes.
I dunno, there's no proof either way. But I think that the majority of the general public are pretty sensible with money. On the whole. Maybe that's my optimist view talking though, or just my anecdotal experience.If you're enjoying that lifestyle without over-stretching yourself, with a financial cushion to meet change of circumstances (and you could probably get by and adapt comfortably if both your incomes fell, or lost one income) and not over-leveraged elsewhere, then that is fine.
Indeed we could. Again, am I being nieve to think that the significant majority live this way? That tends to be my experience.Enjoy your holidays and the rewards from your work in a balanced way, but nothing wrong with my feeling contempt towards those who spent recklessly, and are still spending recklessly... whilst on the brink of financial wipeout.
Yeah, I guess not. But why worry about them? Let them get on with it, who cares. Look after yourself and live life. At the risk of sounding patronising, don't let your contempt for others take over you. It'd make you bitter and twisted and life is too short for that, surely? Take a holiday instead. 0 -
Hallo
I am Ms Positive but working (self employed) in a sector whose attiudes are very 3rd World (I know, I know...not a PC phrase but true) and my take is you can't do anything about the big stuff at all.
The only thing one can do is Rant on and on in Cyberspace about it (used to be a letter to The Times, handwritten) and, for that reason, InternetLand is a good place. Therapy can be pricey.
It didn't exist years ago for people like me when we were making Those Big Life Decisions.
We made the decisions based on a grimy liitle article in The Daily Mail or Standard plus our situation at the time. Man..how stressy is that?
Inflation..if it happens, we'll deal with it.
I, thank goodness every day, that I do not live the life of my grandparents. Safe job for Grandad, bought offplan in the early 30's. Unfortunately, they bought it for the location..nice and high up over London, air was fresher, next to lovely, historic woodland.
Then it became a base for main anti aircraft guns to Hitlers Bombers........the tales he told us as kids went over my head TBH ( I was 12 at the time) but to bring up your family in that situation.
After an air raid, one went outside to see which neighbour wasn't there any more. He saw death on a daily basis whilst bringing up 2 young boys.
Puts things into perspective for me..sorry.0 -
amcluesent wrote: »No.1 sport for fatal heart attacks of course. Just saying...
:rotfl:Never knew that.0 -
Like FC, I'm going back into self-employment, but with a bit more flexibility this time.
If things aren't too bad, I'll continue to sell things that people don't really need, but which are still cheap enough to be seen as a modest little treat.
If things get serious, I'll produce food instead.
If things are very serious, I'll eat the food!0 -
Don't worry too much Cleaver, you don't have to justify yourself. It's your life and your money, you do with them what you like.
We have just returned from the US and have already booked another trip for September. We took our daughter and grandson with us, her job is very stressful at the moment (recruitment), and as they live with us, we were all suffering because of it. It's amazing what a couple of weeks of rest and relaxation can do.
We are older than you and our family have grown up so our mortgage (what's left of it) is small in comparison to OH's income. He is also in a secure job and earns decent (over £70k) money.
Are we worried about things - not really - for if push came to shove OH's retirement would just come forward from planned early retirement towards the end of next year.
I have to admit to being stopped in my tracks a bit late last year and earlier this year with everything. I was getting quite depressed by all the the doom and gloom. But, hey, life goes on.
It was quite nice in the US actually, listening to someone else's doom and gloom and not our own. It made me realise just how lucky we are in this country and we aren't alone in our economic woes.0 -
baileysbattlebus wrote: »
Are we worried about things - not really - for if push came to shove OH's retirement would just come forward from planned early retirement towards the end of next year.
I'm mortgage free, good savings, a job and a deferred final salary pension, but I'm still worried. This recession feels so much worse than the others I have lived through.RENTING? Have you checked to see that your landlord has permission from their mortgage lender to rent the property? If not, you could be thrown out with very little notice.
Read the sticky on the House Buying, Renting & Selling board.0 -
Guess what? Most of the rest of the world's economies are in the sh*t too. Apparently economists are claiming that we were in it first and will get out of it last.
Those sound like some pretty clueless economists, either that or you've got your facts mixed up. The US was in recession much earlier than we were.As far as I am concerned everything is sentiment based. The real reason house prices crashed is due to speculators ramping up values to unrealistic levels.
Nothing to do with lax lending practices then?0 -
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